About installing my new sound system?

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halfdome

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« on: December 10, 2010, 11:40:52 AM »
Hey, I'm new to the group and new to jet boats (this is my second post, and first boat.). I bought a head and 3 - 1000W amps. I also plan to mount 2 12-inch subs in a box up in the bow. Have I made a big mistake here? I mean, am I going to regret adding that much weight up in the front of the boat? I guess these subs, in the box might weigh 50 lbs. Sorry if this is a stupid question, but on the one, I'd like to go fast.. On the other, I need sounds too, don't I? Also, in that closed area am I likely to damage the glass or the gel coat with the thumpers up there? Thanks, Alex


sportinwood

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« Reply #1 on: December 10, 2010, 01:21:24 PM »
what size boat, make, etc? Thats a lot of sound for a boat imo. and if you are lookin to go fast then any extra weight like subs, amps, etc. is gonna slow ya down.

Nixonnow

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« Reply #2 on: December 10, 2010, 01:37:45 PM »
IMO 3000 watts is a bit much for two 12's.... Just one 1000 watt amp would push those subs pretty well. What's the peak RMS for those subs and what is it for the amps?
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« Reply #3 on: December 10, 2010, 02:14:39 PM »
If the speaker box is not bolted on, it will slide around all over the place. If you have headers, which I will guess "no" then you should be able to hear the music. as mentioned, 3k watts is a lot, unless you have have two solo-barics or w3 subs. just leave the music to the wake boarders with their 4 6x9s on the rack.  make sure you use two batteries if you want that kind of power in the boat. plenty of batteries have died at the river because folks play their systems and forget to turn it off.
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halfdome

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« Reply #4 on: December 10, 2010, 02:33:38 PM »
Wow! Thanks for all the replies. The boat is an 18ft Southwind. My thread was a bit misleading, I plan to power the 2 subs with one 1KW Class-D amp. That is about 300 - 500 Watts RMS depending on how I connect the 2 speakers (2-ohms total or 4-ohms if I just use one sub). The other 2 amps are to run the front and rear speakers. I plan to attach the sub box to the stringers. The battery issue is particularly painful, I have added a 200Amp alternator but I really hate to add an additional battery. I do realize that I don't have much choice if I'm going to run this kind of stereo though. Is there a reasonable alternative to a lead-acid bat? Are gel-cells lighter and would they work? I think that answers all the questions, what do you think? Thanks again, Alex

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« Reply #5 on: December 10, 2010, 03:19:51 PM »
the more stereo the better in my book. my 21ft had two 12s and 4 6x9s it rocked pretty well. I have 2 12s and 6 6x9s in my new boat. the weight up front actually helped my boat plain better. I would suggest running 3 batteries though. two for the stereo and a back up for starting. Hook up a batter selector switch that will turn your single batter off and take it out of the system.

other than that stick as much boom in the boat as you can.
When  you turn your boat on... does it return the favor?

Your Mom

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« Reply #6 on: December 10, 2010, 05:23:01 PM »
I run 2 jl amps...one 300x4 and one 500x1. I have a head unit, two 10"subs facing forward with side ports(to get max air space), four 6 1/2 seps and two drive in speakers with seps. I have two 29 marine walmart batts and one runs my system all day. stock alternator....

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« Reply #7 on: December 10, 2010, 06:27:59 PM »
Wow! Thanks for all the replies. The boat is an 18ft Southwind. My thread was a bit misleading, I plan to power the 2 subs with one 1KW Class-D amp. That is about 300 - 500 Watts RMS depending on how I connect the 2 speakers (2-ohms total or 4-ohms if I just use one sub). The other 2 amps are to run the front and rear speakers. I plan to attach the sub box to the stringers. The battery issue is particularly painful, I have added a 200Amp alternator but I really hate to add an additional battery. I do realize that I don't have much choice if I'm going to run this kind of stereo though. Is there a reasonable alternative to a lead-acid bat? Are gel-cells lighter and would they work? I think that answers all the questions, what do you think? Thanks again, Alex

i had a basic pioneer unit with two 6x9s and 2 5x6's and i could hear the music past the headers. one amp would power the mids and high safety. too many wires and amps tends to screw stuff up. my southwind, just as yours was very limited in space. i could fit subs in there because of the bulkhead, so i just put the mids on the bulkhead and the 6x9s in separate boxes next the rear seats. it sounded good for a little stereo.
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halfdome

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« Reply #8 on: December 10, 2010, 09:34:23 PM »
the more stereo the better in my book. my 21ft had two 12s and 4 6x9s it rocked pretty well. I have 2 12s and 6 6x9s in my new boat. the weight up front actually helped my boat plain better. I would suggest running 3 batteries though. two for the stereo and a back up for starting. Hook up a batter selector switch that will turn your single batter off and take it out of the system.

other than that stick as much boom in the boat as you can.

Did you put the batteries up front too? I've been thinking of running two alternators, one for the normal boat systems and the other for the stereo. That would allow me to put the batteries for the stereo up front. The question is, if I gotta eat the weight for two more batteries, where is the best place to put them?
Thanks again.

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« Reply #9 on: December 11, 2010, 07:29:32 AM »
Either two big marine batts or one marine and two 6 volt batts ran in series. I would keep them in back and you can either make a tray or buy a nice one. I made mine out of diamond plate...



YumaJet

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« Reply #10 on: December 11, 2010, 07:42:01 AM »
batteries are best to be kept in the the transom area. ive never seen a battery in the front of a boat, but you can be the first.

remember that a boat is not like a car, so you are not powering lights, a/c units, ect. unless you have a beast of a motor, one alternator and one battery should be fine. i would suggest you adding an additional battery with a perco or isolating switch, for that extra protection of killing battery #1. i would suggest trying one lower based amp for your subs and not connecting any amps to the mids and see how you like it from there. you are very limited on adding a bass thumping/sound speaker system in a 18ft jet boat. it will not sound anything like a car, because its a boat with open space. i had a little day cruiser with 2 12s and some extra mids and it sounded ok. i put that same set up in my car and it sounded a lot better. the boat system would sound better if you dynamat the sides and floors and put the subs in a fiberglass enclosure. thats just adding pounds of weight and would definately affect the handling/weight of the boat.

example; when your sitting in the drivers seat of your 2 dr honda civic, the stereo sounds good. now open your trunk and stand 5 feet away on the curb. it sounds like a rattle can of crap.

easy scenario would be hook up a amp to the 2 subs, have a good head unit with atleast 200 watts per channel and a set of good 4-way mids. that should be simple enough to sound good.

enough of me rambling.  ;D
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YumaJet

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« Reply #11 on: December 11, 2010, 07:44:39 AM »
Either two big marine batts or one marine and two 6 volt batts ran in series. I would keep them in back and you can either make a tray or buy a nice one. I made mine out of diamond plate...




your mom has a clean set-up in the trunk!  (motor area, i know  :P)

i wounder how the hood looks!  :o
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halfdome

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« Reply #12 on: December 11, 2010, 09:26:18 AM »
Thanks for all the help and ideas. I plan to start on this project today so I'll take some pictures as I go. And after seeing the pictures of Your Mom,
I guess I'll be  doing a little more polishing up in the motror area too  ^-^  Thanks again for all the help.

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« Reply #13 on: December 11, 2010, 11:08:24 AM »
the more stereo the better in my book. my 21ft had two 12s and 4 6x9s it rocked pretty well. I have 2 12s and 6 6x9s in my new boat. the weight up front actually helped my boat plain better. I would suggest running 3 batteries though. two for the stereo and a back up for starting. Hook up a batter selector switch that will turn your single batter off and take it out of the system.

other than that stick as much boom in the boat as you can.

I read this and thought to myself "that sounds like something Tony would say."   Then I glance to the left and whaddya know . . .
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« Reply #14 on: December 11, 2010, 01:25:29 PM »
I put a syereo in my 18' tahiti and it thumps really good with one 12 2 5x7's & 2 5 1/4 speakers...im extremely limited on space...so what i did was install a small subfloor under the bow with the sub and amp...then the two little speakers in the bulkhead and the 5x's in the little front engine cover...simple yet you cannot set a beer on the bow of my boat


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« Reply #15 on: December 11, 2010, 01:39:26 PM »






My subs face forward...you can see the boxes and they are anchored to the stringers with ss lag bolts. My amp rack is bolted to the side skirts with four fans above the amps. The stereo is connected to the dash and diamond plate connects it to amp rack with loose rubber mounts to absort wakes. There is much more into detail ....this is solid and sounds bitchn.

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« Reply #16 on: December 11, 2010, 06:42:57 PM »
Without a doubt you'll need a second battery.  Otherwise after listening to music for a few you won't start...

Ganz

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« Reply #17 on: December 11, 2010, 07:09:30 PM »
There is some good info in here and some wrong information. I am not a motor guru but stereo crap is what I know best. 1: Keep the batts in the back 2: One alt should be fine but 2 battery's are needed in a big system in a boat. Get a switch so you can run one batt for the stereo and another to start the boat. 3: Boats are loud and in an open area you need more power. You NEED to use n amp if you want it to sound decent in a boat. With 2 12's under the bow facing forward with that much power you will be surprised how loud it is. It will more than likely flex your bow. 4: PLEASE don't use Dynamat or any other type of sound deadner. Dynamat removes resonance from METAL not fiberglass, to use it in a boat is a waste of money.

To make a recommendation on a system a few questions need to be asked.

1: How much bass do you like?
2: Do you want to rock your boat or the whole river or lake.

What I would do is put 1 12 facing forward under the bow on 1 amp and 4 3way 6x9's or 6.5 coax speakers for the seating area run off another amp. That keeps your weight down decent and gives you pretty damn good sound.

halfdome

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« Reply #18 on: December 11, 2010, 07:45:41 PM »

Damn, I spent the day working on this. Yumajet is dead-on I have no room in my Southwind. I have no idea what I was smoking when I designed this thing but whatever it was, left me totally unable to read a tape measure. I wanted to put the thumpers in front of the bulkhead. I may still be able to do that for one but not two. I had planned to build a simple console box carpet it to match and mount it directly center to hold the head. After I looked at the  "your mom" photos (thanks for that) I couldn't figure out why he went to so much trouble to mount the head. Then I went and looked at my boat again.... The f-ing pedal is right in the way, doh! God, obviously I know nothing about what I'm doing here. This could take days.... Thanks again for the help.

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« Reply #19 on: December 11, 2010, 08:51:58 PM »
Ditch the head unit, get n IPOD with a mini to RCA cable n plug it directly into the amp then use the amp out to the other amps. You can do it all with the IPOD or Zune or whatever you want.

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« Reply #20 on: December 11, 2010, 09:25:22 PM »
In both boats I had, the only reason I had a head unit was to keep my iPod charged otherwise it would die after half the day. Otherwise, ganz does have a pretty good idea.
the jet boat never did this to you bob ::)
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« Reply #21 on: December 11, 2010, 10:04:40 PM »
Damn, I spent the day working on this. Yumajet is dead-on I have no room in my Southwind. I have no idea what I was smoking when I designed this thing but whatever it was, left me totally unable to read a tape measure. I wanted to put the thumpers in front of the bulkhead. I may still be able to do that for one but not two. I had planned to build a simple console box carpet it to match and mount it directly center to hold the head. After I looked at the  "your mom" photos (thanks for that) I couldn't figure out why he went to so much trouble to mount the head. Then I went and looked at my boat again.... The f-ing pedal is right in the way, doh! God, obviously I know nothing about what I'm doing here. This could take days.... Thanks again for the help.

i had my cd player next to the drivers side seat on the left side. i wouldnt' use the ipod directly to the amp, imo, it doesnt give it the output it needs and there IS A sound difference. if that was the case, most people would be doing that.  my bulkhead was with a few inches from the pedal, so there was no way i could of put any kind of sub in there. i couldve cut it, but decided not to. subs need an enclosure to sound good. as it was, folks over 6ft were cramped for space in my old southwind. if you cut into the bulkhead, just make sure to add some reinforcements and add fiberglass.



you can see the cd player knob and 6x9 box on the left side. like i said, it was heard over the headers, so i was happy with it.
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Your Mom

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« Reply #22 on: December 12, 2010, 07:25:24 AM »
The prior owner of my boat had cut my dash under the gauges for a head unit. 7 Years ago a friend and I built this system. Since then I have made upgrades for integrity/vanity. There wasnt a ipod or iphone 7 years ago and I already had a hole in the dash....I use the diamont tray for the radio as a back strap which hides wires, holds my satellite unit as well my bass controll knob. I also have a 12v phone/charger tucked up inside. The most important thing to all of this was for it to be strong and to last. Not bad for a 1973 18' jetboat.



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« Reply #23 on: December 12, 2010, 10:28:39 AM »
Once again thanks for all the help and ideas. The pictures really helped. I have decided that there is no way to mount my 2 keenwood 12's in my boat without taking away all legroom. That was an expensive mistake as now I guess i"m gonna put them in my wifes Civic  >:D. I can mount a bazooka 10" tube to the bulkhead up under the dash. A 10" bazooka is no dual 12's but WTF. The head is an ongoing problem. I will be in Phoenix next week so today is my last day to work on it until I get back. I hink I want to find a way to mount the head unit so I can have HD radio too and the parrot bluetooth is useful. So that's it so far. I post pictures as I start to install everything. Thanks, Alex

halfdome

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« Reply #24 on: December 27, 2010, 10:56:39 AM »
Happy new years everyone. An update on my progress now that I'm back from AZ and Christmas is over. I bought an  8" and a 10" cylindrical concrete forms and then cut them to the appropriate lengths to match an 8" and 10" bazooka. A 10" would work under the dash on the passengers side but not the driver side. And if you have big feet and pointed your toes up, you could touch it on the passengers side. So I bought 2, 8 inch bazookas. I am still waiting on a number of little crap, distributiond blocks, connectors etc, but all of the big stuff is here. The only remaining design issue is  where to put this head unit. It would be so easy, look good, and be really accessable to just cut it into the dash. There is plenty of room. I just don't know if I can bring myself to cut a hole in this boat though. If I build a small console and design it around the pedal , I run the risk of ending up with something tacky. So that is today's big question; would any one consider cutting a hole in the dash of their boat? Or should I find another solution? Is anyone making semi-custom enclosures to hold head units? I have looked around and can't seem to find much online. There are a million people selling various speaker enclosures, maybe I'm surcing with the wrong keywords? As always, I really appreciate all of your opinions and comments, I've really got a ton of good ideas from reading them and seeing your pictures. Thanks, Alex

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« Reply #25 on: December 27, 2010, 03:36:28 PM »
When picking up skiers in my 18ft Horizon, I cannot count how many times we took a wave over the bow and right into our laps.   That boat sat real close to the water and  the slow turnaround and approach to a downed skier had us often headed directly to a big swell.  If you weren't paying attention and ready with a quick blip of throttle you would get seriously soaked.   Just something to keep in mind . . .
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« Reply #26 on: December 27, 2010, 03:47:40 PM »
This is all i did...i didnt have a bulkhead so i made this



Followed by this



Pow mounted....only took a couple hours



I put the cover on it because my feet go down there and didnt want to hit the deck with my feet...also it had a remote so i dont half to reach down there


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« Reply #27 on: January 18, 2011, 04:25:00 PM »
I'm my 20' cruiser I have a 1200W amp running 1 12" in a ported box mounted to the floor under the bow facing the seats. I have 4 6x9's and 2 5x7's in the back. My speakers run off of my head unit which is plenty loud. For the time being, I only have one battery. As long as I monitor my volt gauge, I am fine to start it up after enjoying some tunes for a bit. A 2nd battery is in the near future, and very much needed for high power
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halfdome

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« Reply #28 on: January 21, 2011, 03:45:55 PM »
Yea, with everyone agreeing that two batteries are nice, if not totally required, I've decided to upgrade. As promised, I've been taking photos of every step in this install. There may be as many as 20 or so by the time I'm done. Is that too many to be placing on this site?  Is there a way to attach a link or something, like the youTube videos people post. I am currently saving them on my facebook page. Thanks again for the continues ideas.

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« Reply #29 on: January 21, 2011, 06:30:22 PM »
http://gickr.com/
You can post up to 10 pics for a image show. This will be saved as a single image but will scroll the pics. I use the big size with a nice slideshow.... heres a sample
 


halfdome

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« Reply #30 on: January 23, 2011, 07:19:38 PM »
Well that is truly amazing. I had no idea you had wake-bawd'n pimp cans on that. I decided that's what I wanted to run off my rear amp too. Had no idea what to buy. So I ended up getting Krypts. Mostly cause they claim to be able to take the power I'm throwing at them. I wish I would have known you've already figured that out too :) Obviously on my little 18ft South Wind I can't run a tower; so I plan on mounting them on a couple of short vertical tubes welded to the plates that my battery boxes are attached to (another idea I got from your earlier photos). Maybe I should have just offered to pay you a consulting fee and flown down to see it in person  ;) Thanks again, Alex

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« Reply #31 on: April 03, 2011, 09:02:10 PM »
The good news is that I finished the install today! Thanks for all the help it turned out great and sounds,,,, well,,, loud! I have tried everything to post the pictures I can't even post 1. Something about the pic being too large or the server too slow. No idea... I'm going to try and upload the pics to one of those picture sites and try referencing the URL. Anyway, thanks again and I'll keep trying on the pics.

 


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