Null


Need help & info on 455 Olds

  • 21 Replies
  • 7008 Views

wrenchingirl

  • Join Date: Jun 2015
  • *
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 24
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • Registered User
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
« on: June 21, 2015, 09:14:02 PM »
Hi guys, OK don't laugh. I am learning how to work on my 1974-75.  455 Olds in my flat bottom. Husband passed from cancer last Dec & I feel like he would be proud. The thing was spewing oil everywhere. Used to be turn key. With the help of my neighbor I tore it all the way down with heads off. All new gaskets, new headers, bilge pump & switch. I bent water lines installed a puke tank. Found a guy from Craig's list to fabricate a plate for me.  Put back together & she purrs like a kitten. Had her up to 3500 rpm running great then started hearing ROD KNOCKING...Shut motor off immediately! I started it back up for a split second to see if froze. Nope it started. Didn't go thru. So before I take valve cover off in looking for tips & pointers to fix it myself.
Do I need to do both sides?
Its was just the drivers side.
Do I replace all rods & rockers?
Or just one rod?
What's the specs on tightening?
I have a million questions & am excited to learn.
Please help... :)
I have a million questions...


mobboss

  • Join Date: Jun 2011
  • Location: elkins AR
  • *
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,323
  • Karma: +15/-0
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 2
« Reply #1 on: June 21, 2015, 10:06:44 PM »
Good looking boat! Well if it is a rod knock like you think the engine has to come out and be tore down completely. You sure it was a rod knock??? They are real distinctive. 

Sent from my VK810 4G using SoCal Jet Boats mobile app

  • Boat #1: boat less

GT Jets

  • Join Date: Jan 2007
  • Location: Morgan Hill CA
  • *
  • Informative Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 11,748
  • Karma: +192/-0
  • Team Evil Weiner
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 138
« Reply #2 on: June 21, 2015, 10:53:26 PM »
Hi guys, OK don't laugh.

First off. Laugh? I think it's awesome that your here.   :thumbup: :thumbup: 8)

One thing you need to know about this site. There is no such thing as a dumb question. (unless you ask it twice LOL).

Now here goes. I will do my best.

I am learning how to work on my 1974-75.  455 Olds in my flat bottom. Husband passed from cancer last Dec & I feel like he would be proud.

I cannot tell you how sorry I am for your loss. I can't imagine.   :thumbdown:


The thing was spewing oil everywhere. Used to be turn key. With the help of my neighbor I tore it all the way down with heads off. All new gaskets, new headers, bilge pump & switch. I bent water lines installed a puke tank.

How cool is that?


Found a guy from Craig's list to fabricate a plate for me.  Put back together & she purrs like a kitten. Had her up to 3500 rpm running great then started hearing ROD KNOCKING...Shut motor off immediately!

When you say rod, we talking deep dark ugly expensive thump? Or a rattle type top end noise?


I started it back up for a split second to see if froze. Nope it started. Didn't go thru. So before I take valve cover off in looking for tips & pointers to fix it myself.

I feel the problem is going to be in the bottom end, not the top. Like moboss says, likely needs to come out.


Do I need to do both sides?
Its was just the drivers side.
Do I replace all rods & rockers?
Or just one rod?
What's the specs on tightening?

This question, while intelligent, is hard to answer. I do not feel the problem will be in the valve train, I feel and fear it is much worse. We need some information to be able to help. What was the oil pressure, how much oil was in the pan, what did the knock sound like etc?

The Oldsmobile is a fairly robust engine, but not without it's fair share of issues. Unfortunately one of the weak links is the oiling system when it comes to a jet boat application.



I have a million questions & am excited to learn.

Please help... :)
I have a million questions...

I will only answer about three thousand. Your on your own for the rest...  ::)

Good looking boat and welcome to SoCal Jetboats .com

GT
  • Boat #1: 1992 Carrera 20.5 Elite (I/O bitches)
  • Boat #2: 19' Bubble deck Jet BBC Berkeley
If i get some free time tonight at work, ill play with it and post it for everyone to see.

Time to man up and yank it John!  :banghead:
Ray

Flusher

  • Join Date: Sep 2011
  • Location: Colton, CA
  • *
  • Macho Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,077
  • Karma: +74/-0
  • The Machinist
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 26
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2015, 12:47:17 AM »
First off. Laugh? I think it's awesome that your here.   :thumbup: :thumbup: 8)

Good looking boat and welcome to SoCal Jetboats .com

GT

X2

Cheers,

Joe
"I want to roll with my brother Joe" - Joe Bateman - January 29, 1950 ~ November 27, 2013

wrenchingirl

  • Join Date: Jun 2015
  • *
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 24
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • Registered User
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2015, 01:18:30 AM »
Rattle top end noise under valve cover. Will take off valve cover Monday and let ya know what I find.. Also was told I might have a clog in water line. At 3500 flying jetavator it started getting hot. Tried to adjust water @ ball valves at intake manifold with no luck. Saw no diff of water coming out of headers wide open or full closed.
Hnmmm will replace lines but hope that's all it is..

wrenchingirl

  • Join Date: Jun 2015
  • *
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 24
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • Registered User
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2015, 01:21:09 AM »
Boat has big baffled oil pan. Holds 8 quarts..
Put new dip stick while headers were off..

wrenchingirl

  • Join Date: Jun 2015
  • *
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 24
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • Registered User
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2015, 01:25:56 AM »
We have a place called "The Cove" here at Lake Elsinore. Its like being at the river on weekends. I pulled thru and all the guys were oggling and told me the motor sounded sweet. Dam..
Back to the drawing board. But I'm determined! More $$ lol

wrenchingirl

  • Join Date: Jun 2015
  • *
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 24
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • Registered User
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2015, 01:33:19 AM »
Thanks for the condolences. He passed away from esophageal cancer Dec. 15th. Complications if pneumonia. Very sad.
Off work injured ...
I was his care taker..
He raced dirt oval go karts with So Cal Oval Karters. 2013 Champion F200 class.

wrenchingirl

  • Join Date: Jun 2015
  • *
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 24
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • Registered User
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2015, 01:37:28 AM »
On lighter note;
I discovered DAWN dish soap lol

MorePower

  • Join Date: May 2013
  • Location: Orange County
  • *
  • Macho Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,529
  • Karma: +20/-0
  • Blue Bayou
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 6
« Reply #9 on: June 22, 2015, 05:26:19 AM »
Hey! Welcome!
So you say the motor was getting hot before this knock occurred?
  • Boat #1: 1974 18ft Southwind

wrenchingirl

  • Join Date: Jun 2015
  • *
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 24
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • Registered User
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
« Reply #10 on: June 22, 2015, 06:44:37 AM »
It seemed so but the temp gauge was reading 108...the whole time. When I shut it off it said 180. I could tell thou. I was back there while my friend drove trying to adjust water in headers. Had nothing. Opened both ball valves all way. Then closed. Nothing changed. But there was water to the headers cuz it was dripping by water lines...
I couldn't get it to cone out header pipe so I could see it..
Maybe clog in my line somewhere?
That's what a guy told me

MorePower

  • Join Date: May 2013
  • Location: Orange County
  • *
  • Macho Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,529
  • Karma: +20/-0
  • Blue Bayou
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 6
« Reply #11 on: June 22, 2015, 07:29:48 PM »
Hmmm... Hard for me to diagnose the water issue, but the knocking noise is what has my attention... How long were you on the throttle before the knocking started?
  • Boat #1: 1974 18ft Southwind

5150whiteboy

  • Join Date: Jan 2012
  • Location: Monrovia, ca
  • *
  • Macho Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,606
  • Karma: +24/-0
  • Registered User
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 12
« Reply #12 on: June 22, 2015, 07:52:21 PM »
Hmmm... Hard for me to diagnose the water issue, but the knocking noise is what has my attention... How long were you on the throttle before the knocking started?
^^^^^^this???
5150WhiteBoy

wrenchingirl

  • Join Date: Jun 2015
  • *
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 24
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • Registered User
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
« Reply #13 on: June 22, 2015, 08:01:48 PM »
About 15 min going around lake...

MorePower

  • Join Date: May 2013
  • Location: Orange County
  • *
  • Macho Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,529
  • Karma: +20/-0
  • Blue Bayou
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 6
« Reply #14 on: June 22, 2015, 08:07:31 PM »
15 minutes at 3500rpm? Did you do any sharp turns just before the noise started?
  • Boat #1: 1974 18ft Southwind

selbycnlb

  • Join Date: Oct 2014
  • *
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 114
  • Karma: +1/-0
  • Registered User
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
« Reply #15 on: June 22, 2015, 08:40:05 PM »
Usually when we talk of a rod knock we are talking about the connecting rod which connects the piston to the crankshaft(bottom end of the engine)-devastating.

There are push rods that lay on top of lifters which are moved up and down by a cam which actuate the rocker arms which actuate the valves which have springs. (Top end)

A rattle can be because oil is not up in the valve train( under the valve covers)
-oil level issue
-or oil pump issue

A rattle could be a loose rocker
- not sure what tightening spec is probably tighten all the way down back off 1/4turn when zero lobe? Might not be adjustable if stock then you will have to work with pushrod length

Or could be other stuff in valve train you will need to take off valve covers(both) and check it all out to make sure it looks good.

Go from there if it all looks good then you will probably need to pull engine and deal with your bottom end.








Sent from my iPhone using SoCal Jet Boats

TIMINATOR

  • Join Date: Mar 2007
  • Location: Avondale,AZ. 85392 (West Phoenix)
  • *
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 230
  • Karma: +5/-0
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
« Reply #16 on: June 22, 2015, 11:56:39 PM »
IMHO an 8 quart pan is too small for a healthy Olds, they have serious oiling and drain back issues. If the engine needs to come out, and even if it doesn't, find a print or online copy of the HotBoat Olds engine build up from about 2005. Lots of good info about Olds engines and their inherent issues. The only dated info is regarding intake manifolds. All is true as written except the Crosswind dual plane is now the best inexpensive intake manifold for 5500/5700 RPM or less. We have made around 680 HP with that DUAL PLANE intake, (88 MPH in a Biesmeyer 18 1/2' jet.) The Performer RPM dual plane is just slightly better at the higher end of the range, mebbie 8-10 HP, but since a jet requires about 20 HP/MPH gain most don't think that for 100 bucks more is worth it for 1/2 MPH.
For lower HP engines, use the ARP conversion rocker studs and SB Ford stainless steel roller rocker arms, big cams and roller cams we drill and rethread the heads for 7/16" rocker studs.   TIMINATOR
TUFENUF MARINE PERFORMANCE  623-877-8553
COMPLETE ENGINE MACHINESHOP & PERFORMANCE
JET PUMPS!!!
PM or call me with JETTECH questions for HOTBOAT MAGAZINE!!  see them in the magazine!! OOPS! not anymore! HOTBOAT is boobs up! MODESTY IS A CRUTCH FOR THE INCOMPETENT!

wrenchingirl

  • Join Date: Jun 2015
  • *
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 24
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • Registered User
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
« Reply #17 on: June 23, 2015, 01:36:12 AM »
I will take valve cover off tomorrow... Sounded like rod hitting valve cover top end. Immediately shut off. Restarted to see if would for split second n it did. Think valves didn't get adjusted right. My neighbor did that part...

wrenchingirl

  • Join Date: Jun 2015
  • *
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 24
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • Registered User
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
« Reply #18 on: June 23, 2015, 01:51:48 AM »
No sharp turns..

wrenchingirl

  • Join Date: Jun 2015
  • *
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 24
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • Registered User
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
« Reply #19 on: June 23, 2015, 01:54:49 AM »
I'm gonna install new water pump too..

GT Jets

  • Join Date: Jan 2007
  • Location: Morgan Hill CA
  • *
  • Informative Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 11,748
  • Karma: +192/-0
  • Team Evil Weiner
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 138
« Reply #20 on: June 23, 2015, 06:58:40 AM »
I'm gonna install new water pump too..

Does it have a water pump?

Not all that unusual, just doubt it has one.

Normally the jet pump is the only water pump.

Good luck on it being the top end, that would be awesome. Thinking you were hearing the piston top touching the head.

Hope in totally wrong.

GT

Sent from my SCH-I545 using SoCal Jet Boats mobile app

  • Boat #1: 1992 Carrera 20.5 Elite (I/O bitches)
  • Boat #2: 19' Bubble deck Jet BBC Berkeley
If i get some free time tonight at work, ill play with it and post it for everyone to see.

Time to man up and yank it John!  :banghead:
Ray

TIMINATOR

  • Join Date: Mar 2007
  • Location: Avondale,AZ. 85392 (West Phoenix)
  • *
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 230
  • Karma: +5/-0
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
« Reply #21 on: June 23, 2015, 07:38:11 AM »
Factory Olds engines do not have an adjustable valve train. If a large cam is used, often the rockers or pushrods will fail. If it has been converted using the kit with the stock bolt size into the head, those often fail by either pulling out the threads in the heads, breaking off the top of the stud, or the poly locks coming loose. If this is the case, you can just fix the bad parts and hope it doesn't happen again, or remove the heads and have a machine shop ream and retap the stud holes for a regular size screw in stud, those are much stronger. Breakage of studs is usually caused by over tightening the poly locks, over compressing the valvesprings, or incorrect valvetrain geometry. We prefer using stud girdles as you don't need to over tighten the poly lock to get them to stay in adjustment.  Post pics.  TIMINATOR
TUFENUF MARINE PERFORMANCE  623-877-8553
COMPLETE ENGINE MACHINESHOP & PERFORMANCE
JET PUMPS!!!
PM or call me with JETTECH questions for HOTBOAT MAGAZINE!!  see them in the magazine!! OOPS! not anymore! HOTBOAT is boobs up! MODESTY IS A CRUTCH FOR THE INCOMPETENT!

 


Website Security Test
Powered by EzPortal

Website Security Test