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Ford Rebuild Disappointment

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angermgmt

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« on: June 12, 2019, 08:58:46 AM »
Well I previously wiped a cam and recently put the engine back together with essentially the same components. Problem is I lost 400-500 RPM in the process.   

460 Ford .030 over, different block

KB Hypers, new rings and gapped to marine specs

Comp Cam 585/305, 1/4 turn lash on hydronic lifters

New lifters and push rods

Same valves lapped & shimmed

Eagle H Beam rods

Rotating assembly balance way within 1/2 gram

Dual Holley 600ís with tunnel ram

Aggressor A impeller.

The only changes were a different block (not decked) and the Eagle rods which replaced stock rods. Compression test showed 120PSI across the board and the plugs look clean almost too clean like itís running lean. Idles perfect and runs good except I stay at 4500 rpm with a lot of peddle left. Vacuum at WOT is essentially zero.

Can not decking the block create this much of a compression loss?  Do I need to re check valve lash and timing?  Iím at a loss and pretty disappointed.

Thanks for any help in advance.

B



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mash on it

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« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2019, 09:08:33 AM »
2 questions-

Was the cam degreed in? On both combos?

New pushrods measured for the new combo?

Ok, 3 questions-
Fresh gas in the boat?

How much was the other block decked? (That's 4....) and new rods the same length?

Just thinking out loud.

Dan'l

I feel your heartache. Roller cams are cheaper than doing it twice.
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angermgmt

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« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2019, 11:11:05 AM »
#1 unknown and no. Installed the timing set in the same 0 position.

#2 new pushrods were same length

#3 yes fresh gas

#4 unknown as it can with boat. Did a rough measurement bottom of cylinder to top of cylinder on both and they appeared the same, but like I said rough. And yes h beam rods same length.

Thanks B


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mash on it

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« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2019, 11:33:57 AM »
I know it's not the easiest thing to do, but I set the distributor timing on the water.

Your Ford should be fairly easy with the front dizzy.

Have someone drive, and keep it steady, about 3K to 3500 rpm.

Slowly twist (advanve) the dizzy to achieve more rpm, watching the tach, without more throttle.

Once it goes too far, the rpm will drop, bring it back a little. Then lock it down.

This is what the engine wants, at that air temp and elevation, ie:- Elsinore will be different than the river.

Not unheard of to gain 500 rpm.

Just my $0.02

Dan'l
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angermgmt

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« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2019, 11:42:51 AM »
Thanks. Iíve done that before on the water. Iím hoping thatís it. When I swapped blocks I made a template in order to duplicate where my distributor to block points met.  Operator error and a different block may have thrown it off. Just to double check, 3000-3500 and not 2000-2500???


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mash on it

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« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2019, 02:09:28 PM »
Thanks. Iíve done that before on the water. Iím hoping thatís it. When I swapped blocks I made a template in order to duplicate where my distributor to block points met.  Operator error and a different block may have thrown it off. Just to double check, 3000-3500 and not 2000-2500???


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Your distributor should be all in by 3K,
And you'll be planing, or ya should be.

My big azz sled is still on top till about 28-2900.

Dan'l
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angermgmt

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« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2019, 02:35:43 PM »
Very good thank you. Iíll report back once we get it tested.


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angermgmt

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« Reply #7 on: June 13, 2019, 02:14:45 PM »
So, while Iím waiting on some parts I decided to do a cold leak down test on all the cylinders. 20-30Ē average on a newly machined block and new rings blending into crankcase.  I know there are different opinions regarding cold vs hot tests, but I am besides frustrated, this appears way too loose for a new build.  🤯


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angermgmt

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« Reply #8 on: June 13, 2019, 02:38:29 PM »
With that my plugs are lean clean ??????


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Tikotiko

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« Reply #9 on: June 14, 2019, 04:32:15 AM »
I know it's not the easiest thing to do, but I set the distributor timing on the water.

Your Ford should be fairly easy with the front dizzy.

Have someone drive, and keep it steady, about 3K to 3500 rpm.

Slowly twist (advanve) the dizzy to achieve more rpm, watching the tach, without more throttle.

Once it goes too far, the rpm will drop, bring it back a little. Then lock it down.

This is what the engine wants, at that air temp and elevation, ie:- Elsinore will be different than the river.

Not unheard of to gain 500 rpm.

Just my $0.02

Dan'l
This is great maybe i shouldnt worry about the number of degrees on mine either and just give it what it wants

Tikotiko

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« Reply #10 on: June 14, 2019, 04:38:59 AM »
Im trying to learn everything i can about my boat with a bbf. If u need help with anything. Im no ford expert but i pick things up quickly. Id love to see what you have going on. My rpms are topping out just under 4000 closer to 3900. Its unfortunate you having problems but i think learning from your problems will solve mine.

FordLover

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« Reply #11 on: June 14, 2019, 08:44:03 AM »
I know it's not the easiest thing to do, but I set the distributor timing on the water.

Your Ford should be fairly easy with the front dizzy.

Have someone drive, and keep it steady, about 3K to 3500 rpm.

Slowly twist (advanve) the dizzy to achieve more rpm, watching the tach, without more throttle.

Once it goes too far, the rpm will drop, bring it back a little. Then lock it down.

This is what the engine wants, at that air temp and elevation, ie:- Elsinore will be different than the river.

Not unheard of to gain 500 rpm.

Just my $0.02

Dan'l
First off, the title of this thread makes me sad. I actually felt the pain.


And this info right here makes too much sense. Makes me wonder why I never did this. Kind of excited to see what happens after adjustment. Hope you come back with an excited response.

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angermgmt

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« Reply #12 on: June 14, 2019, 09:07:55 AM »
Hopefully, I only have a few runs on it probably less than two hours so Iím kinda hoping that the rings arenít completely seated yet. Going to restrict a bit more water to the block to bring the heat up.


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mash on it

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« Reply #13 on: June 14, 2019, 11:12:19 AM »
Hopefully, I only have a few runs on it probably less than two hours so Iím kinda hoping that the rings arenít completely seated yet. Going to restrict a bit more water to the block to bring the heat up.


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What engine oil and what rings?

Synthetic oil and chrome rings is not very friendly for break-in.

On the water temp, no need to go crazy, 180į for a short run is plenty.

Dan'l
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angermgmt

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« Reply #14 on: June 14, 2019, 01:49:00 PM »
Hastings rings and Valvoline VR1 20/50 high zinc


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« Reply #15 on: June 14, 2019, 01:51:16 PM »
And my temp has been at 160 or so since Iíve only been cruising. Only got on it a few days ago when the issues presented themselves.


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