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jet fever

  • Karma: +7/-2
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #75 on: March 17, 2015, 11:13:08 AM »
Wish we could see the loader metal angle.  I bet if you alter the shape you could pick up more mph
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jet fever

  • Karma: +7/-2
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #76 on: March 17, 2015, 11:16:31 AM »
Btw good lookin Southwind
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jyeager

  • Karma: +62/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #77 on: March 17, 2015, 01:13:52 PM »
Wish we could see the loader metal angle.  I bet if you alter the shape you could pick up more mph

I seriously doubt it. I not surprised to see a loss in MPH. If you were on the track i bet you would see a big gain in E.T.

MPH doesn't mean crap IMO.
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jet fever

  • Karma: +7/-2
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #78 on: March 17, 2015, 01:40:24 PM »
Well If I lost 5mph Id try to find a loader with a arc to put as much water into the area as possible so I knew I was getting as much force from my pump as possible.  Could be wrong but just a suggestion.  Ride is better but Id want to gain the speed back and that pump has alot of goodies already
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jyeager

  • Karma: +62/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #79 on: March 17, 2015, 01:49:47 PM »

Well If I lost 5mph Id try to find a loader with a arc to put as much water into the area as possible so I knew I was getting as much force from my pump as possible.  Could be wrong but just a suggestion.  Ride is better but Id want to gain the speed back and that pump has alot of goodies already
It's a good idea. But, if you put a more aggressive loader into the boat then you run into over charging problems. The only real way to know what's going on is to tap the intake and bowl for pressure. witch I am sure Chris has talked to him about. 
Like I said. He may have dropped MPH but the boat most likely is quicker all around with the plates like that.


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Flusher

  • Karma: +84/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #80 on: March 17, 2015, 02:38:11 PM »
If you install a more aggressive loader, the leading edges might hang down below keel.  Sure it will load the pump harder, but it will stick the boat to the water and scrub off speed.  Loading the pump is a balancing act with drag.  More load = more drag.  The question becomes, did the change make the boat quicker/faster?  As the setup becomes more aggressive, the drag increases; but the pump loads harder, creates more thrust, and performance increases.  That is until you go too far and the drag increases more than performance.  The only way to really get your float optimized is to test and monitor, make one change at a time and repeat.

There is a compromise to the performance gains.  Once you start going faster, the shutdown becomes more dangerous.
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"I want to roll with my brother Joe" - Joe Bateman - January 29, 1950 ~ November 27, 2013

78Southwind

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #81 on: March 17, 2015, 02:47:18 PM »
I read *BN*'s (Brian Neal) posts years ago and he said that all that was needed was 1/16" down on the cavitation plates and it cured his problem. He actually gained speed but his porpoise was much worse than mine but his speed was a lot higher than mine too (88 MPH). I don't think he ever took it back to the track but at the river he posted a gain of somewhere around 5 or 6 MPH. He probably only gained a couple MPH since he was at the river and probably GPSing down river.

Squitcha? (Dan) posted that he ended up at 1/8 down on the cavitation plates and it cured his problems. However, he never GPSed his boat after the installation so who knows if he gained, lost or broke even.

I have only GPSed my boat at the river until this last test. I usually ran 78 MPH down river and 72 up river. So I figured that the current must of been around 3 MPH giving me an honest 75 MPH speed. When I tested at Lake Elsinore last week it ran 70 MPH. So that's where I am getting my data. I am probably going to run it at the river before I make the changes.

I am trying to only make one change at a time so i won't make any other changes until the plates are machined and then I will go from there.

With all that said, what are your guys opinions of getting the plates closer between 1/16" to 1/8" of down? I would think that it would create less drag allowing the boat to ride on less wetted area. Possibly finding a happy medium between ride quality and speed.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2015, 02:53:48 PM by 78Southwind »
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78Southwind

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #82 on: March 17, 2015, 03:43:14 PM »
Out testing on Lake Elsinore. O0

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Flusher

  • Karma: +84/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #83 on: March 17, 2015, 03:43:22 PM »
My reply was really an attempt to address the loader comment and not to question your testing methods.  I'm not trying to stir the pot and no disrespect intended.

I calculate that if I machine the water surface of the angle, I could take it down another 1-1.3 degrees which would equate to .052-.068 up at the trailing edge.  From there, the surface against the transom can be angle cut to achieve approximately .052 per degree.  I think 2-2.5 degrees off the transom side would be about the maximum I could remove without thinning the material too much.

The decision to error on the safe side while still effecting a positive change was made.

Respectfully submitted,

Joe
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"I want to roll with my brother Joe" - Joe Bateman - January 29, 1950 ~ November 27, 2013

78Southwind

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #84 on: March 17, 2015, 04:12:09 PM »
My reply was really an attempt to address the loader comment and not to question your testing methods.  I'm not trying to stir the pot and no disrespect intended.

I calculate that if I machine the water surface of the angle, I could take it down another 1-1.3 degrees which would equate to .052-.068 up at the trailing edge.  From there, the surface against the transom can be angle cut to achieve approximately .052 per degree.  I think 2-2.5 degrees off the transom side would be about the maximum I could remove without thinning the material too much.

The decision to error on the safe side while still effecting a positive change was made.

Respectfully submitted,

Joe

No disrespect taken, the post wasn't intended as a reply to you but rather me thinking out loud and looking for some comments about my thought process and hoping I was right. I am not even sure if I am measuring right compared to where Brian and Dan were measuring. Don't get me wrong the ride is awesome just looking to pick up some of the speed that was lost. Can you calculate what the hook would look like with those cuts?
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Flusher

  • Karma: +84/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #85 on: March 17, 2015, 04:42:42 PM »
Can you calculate what the hook would look like with those cuts?

Running some quick numbers, it looks like I can reduce it by approximately .164.  Forgive me for being conservative, but I am concerned about going too far.  Might be able to squeeze a little more out of it without thinning the material too much.
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"I want to roll with my brother Joe" - Joe Bateman - January 29, 1950 ~ November 27, 2013

78Southwind

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #86 on: March 17, 2015, 05:37:29 PM »
Running some quick numbers, it looks like I can reduce it by approximately .164.  Forgive me for being conservative, but I am concerned about going too far.  Might be able to squeeze a little more out of it without thinning the material too much.

If I am understanding you right then it should be perfect. If the hook is 1/4 (.25) and you reduced it by .164 the hook would be .086. That's pretty close to the middle of 1/16 (.0625) and 1/8 (.125). Which was my goal. I will see if I can get some calipers in there to get a more precise measurement.
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78Southwind

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #87 on: April 02, 2015, 08:14:57 PM »
Hey Joe,
I don't know if you got my PM. I don't know if we are talking the same thing since I don't know what to call it other than "hook" and I don't know the math but what I did is measured the hook that was created by the tab. I couldn't get any calipers in there so I put a straight edge on the hull and the tab and came up with a little over 3/16" of a hook. I wanted it to be somewhere between a 1/16" ( 0.0625) to a 1/8" (0.125) hook. Chris and I agreed that 0.100 would be our goal. Let me know if I am being clear.
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Flusher

  • Karma: +84/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #88 on: April 02, 2015, 08:24:57 PM »
PM sent referencing this thread
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"I want to roll with my brother Joe" - Joe Bateman - January 29, 1950 ~ November 27, 2013

78Southwind

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #89 on: April 09, 2015, 02:34:56 PM »
I got my tabs back. They look bitchen.



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loweryjennifer

  • Karma: +14/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #90 on: April 09, 2015, 02:41:33 PM »
Looks nice. 👍


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78Southwind

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #91 on: April 09, 2015, 02:46:32 PM »
Looks nice. 👍


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Thanks
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jimpen

  • Karma: +68/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #92 on: April 09, 2015, 07:00:31 PM »

I got my tabs back. They look bitchen.




. Just a heads up most guys run slower at Elsinore I have heard 3-5 mile per hour. This has something to do with the water


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78southwindtdeck

  • Karma: +3/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #93 on: April 09, 2015, 07:43:03 PM »
Don't think that is true I run 62 mph on elsinore with a basic stock 460 mild cam and a 12 jg a
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78Southwind

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #94 on: April 09, 2015, 07:52:32 PM »
. Just a heads up most guys run slower at Elsinore I have heard 3-5 mile per hour. This has something to do with the water


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Lol well I guess I should have GPS'd it at Parker.
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bbfsouthwind

  • Karma: +3/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #95 on: April 09, 2015, 07:54:34 PM »
How far is your motor from the transom? I am have a 18' v bottom southwind with a 800+hp 545, I have moved the motor forward a few Inches.
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jimpen

  • Karma: +68/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #96 on: April 09, 2015, 07:54:38 PM »

Lol well I guess I should have GPS'd it at Parker.
. Yes sir unless you base test was there you got notta


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78Southwind

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #97 on: April 09, 2015, 08:00:52 PM »
How far is your motor from the transom? I am have a 18' v bottom southwind with a 800+hp 545, I have moved the motor forward a few Inches.
Moving the motor was the first suggestion but I have quarter stringers and with the current setup I have I can't really go much more forward.
« Last Edit: April 09, 2015, 08:05:52 PM by 78Southwind »
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78Southwind

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #98 on: April 09, 2015, 08:05:21 PM »
. Yes sir unless you base test was there you got notta


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Well maybe I didn't lose any speed at all. Jason and I were playing around a little bit at Parker and his boat does 80 and I ended up about three quarters of a boat length ahead of them. But I'm also running an inducer and he's not.
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bbfsouthwind

  • Karma: +3/-0
Re: Pump Work
« Reply #99 on: April 09, 2015, 08:15:40 PM »
I was just wondering because i have not ran my boat yet. But I have converted mine to full stringer.
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