Running pump water line straight to the engine?????

« **on:** May 02, 2011, 07:44:32 PM »

I was sitting at roadrunner the other day talking to a older man who had a cherry biesemeyer . I was telling him that I could never get my new motor to run below 180 . It always sits at 180 -200 at idle. Everything is the hooked up the same , timing , jetting great . New pump and no obstructions ....... anyways he told me why not run the pump water line straight to the motor and forget preheating through the logs ...... I never run in ice cold water , so has any one done this ???Any Ideas ???Thanks

« **Reply #1 on:** May 02, 2011, 08:07:20 PM »

are you running a gate valve/ball valve? my guess would be open it up a little if you are running one.

« **Reply #2 on:** May 02, 2011, 08:26:06 PM »

Those of us running headers are doing just that!

I remember Ralph and I had a conversation at Elsinore once (in early January) about how cold the water was. I commented how Moo always ran about 140 no matter what, where or when, and his wouldn't didn't go over 100 or something that day. Same setups, no logs.

The logs, however, are aluminum, and I think that might not be a good idea to divert the cold water from them.

Are you running a thermostat? Your temps seem higher than I've ever gotten with logs. I've never gotten Pickle over 160-170 with your setup.

To be honest with you though, at 180-200, you're right in the normal street range for the engine, and I for one would leave it alone. That is the exact range your engine was designed, tested, developed and intended to run at........

Ray

« **Reply #3 on:** May 02, 2011, 09:39:12 PM »

with my logs preheating i had to close my gate valve a lot to get to 160-180 temps. full open the motor barely even got warm enough to move the needle.

« **Reply #4 on:** May 02, 2011, 09:56:30 PM »

Quote from: IRRebel on May 02, 2011, 08:26:06 PM

To be honest with you though, at 180-200, you're right in the normal street range for the engine, and I for one would leave it alone. That is the exact range your engine was designed, tested, developed and intended to run at........

Ray

X2, do you have a concern of going beyond this temp? If it does stay consistant then I would leave it also, that's what some of us try for all weekend and don't always get there.

« **Reply #5 on:** May 03, 2011, 07:57:24 AM »

No gate valve , I removed it to try to get the temp down more ...... I know the temp is in a good range but I am baffled that my last engine which was less modified sat at 140 all day . Rebel your right about the aluminum logs they would probably get to hot ...... I guess I will just run it at 180 and be content.

« **Reply #6 on:** May 03, 2011, 08:12:21 AM »

Have you flushed your block recently....I get at least a coffee cup full of sand or more a season.

« **Reply #7 on:** May 03, 2011, 09:26:42 AM »

Motor was just fully rebuilt . Only have 3 trips on the engine .

« **Reply #8 on:** May 03, 2011, 12:04:56 PM »

If it lookes like water is flowing fine..even at idle...I would be second guessing my gauge. Maybe u can borrow a laser pyrometer and dbl. check it. If your water temp is 180-200* I would hate to see what your oil temps look like.

« **Reply #9 on:** May 03, 2011, 02:50:22 PM »

My BBC ran water from the pump past a gate valve to an Olson oil cooler from there it went to the block out the front of the heads then into my drake exhaust manafolds exited the top of the manafolds and was plumbed to the exhaust tips. (Ski Jet II class required logs at the time). My only complaint was I hadn't run lines up under the seat to allow the gate valve to be within reach and adjustible from the driver's seat. That one change I would recommend to anyone not using a closed system.

« **Reply #10 on:** May 03, 2011, 04:08:16 PM »

Quote from: wizard612 on May 03, 2011, 02:50:22 PM

My BBC ran water from the pump past a gate valve to an Olson oil cooler from there it went to the block out the front of the heads then into my drake exhaust manafolds exited the top of the manafolds and was plumbed to the exhaust tips. (Ski Jet II class required logs at the time). My only complaint was I hadn't run lines up under the seat to allow the gate valve to be within reach and adjustible from the driver's seat. That one change I would recommend to anyone not using a closed system.

I get the concerns,especially the driver mount valve, mostly due to reversion issues in headers (I have first hand catastrophe's with this). But really? if water temps are in the optimal 180-200 range, considering most ALL jet boats have extended quantity oil pans of some sort, where would Oil temps rise to a near dangerous level on an even 1-2 hour 5000 RPM full throttle blast up river compared to a cross country F350 with the same engine, towing, running 36 or so hours straight?

My point being, these BB engines were designed for this! Maybe I'm not getting it, but after last season when many of us blew up our motors, I started to really think about this. Oil temp was not an issue. Marc and I both agreed a LONG time ago that oil temp and water temp, while co-exist, were not necsscrily that closely related, due to the RPM range we run. But we agreed that while heat transfer from oil to water was not as closely related in a boat as it would be in a car or truck, the added oil capacity in all of our boats should negate that differential. Especially since they are run for much shorter bursts.

Ray

« **Reply #11 on:** May 04, 2011, 07:26:18 AM »

Reversion issue a good one but I don't think it's a problem as much with logs or dry stacks. We always tried to optimize heat temps for max HP we preheated the water with oil cooler. Not having the valve where I could get to it easily cost me a national championship when I was sabotaged. Some one closed off my valve prior to the first heat and I had to work my way back past a blazing hot motor to open the valve during the 5min period took me a bit more time than I had and started last, ended third. Won the second heat by over a quarter lap (at firebird) Second overall.

« **Reply #12 on:** May 04, 2011, 08:09:19 AM »

Quote from: IRRebel on May 03, 2011, 04:08:16 PM

I get the concerns,especially the driver mount valve, mostly due to reversion issues in headers (I have first hand catastrophe's with this). But really? if water temps are in the optimal 180-200 range, considering most ALL jet boats have extended quantity oil pans of some sort, where would Oil temps rise to a near dangerous level on an even 1-2 hour 5000 RPM full throttle blast up river compared to a cross country F350 with the same engine, towing, running 36 or so hours straight?

My point being, these BB engines were designed for this! Maybe I'm not getting it, but after last season when many of us blew up our motors, I started to really think about this. Oil temp was not an issue. Marc and I both agreed a LONG time ago that oil temp and water temp, while co-exist, were not necsscrily that closely related, due to the RPM range we run. But we agreed that while heat transfer from oil to water was not as closely related in a boat as it would be in a car or truck, the added oil capacity in all of our boats should negate that differential. Especially since they are run for much shorter bursts.
Maybe his oil teps are fine....with out a gauge its pretty tuff to tell. I have seen 240 plus on my oil once....water temp showed 120ish...maybe another 80* of water temp wouldn't affect it...seems like it would. I thought boat motors were put together looser to compensate for the cold water ect.
Ray

« **Reply #13 on:** May 04, 2011, 08:25:40 AM »

Water temp in a single pass system should be 30* to 60* above lake/river temp, 180*+ (80* lake + 100*) in a single pass is too hot, IMO. Mine W/Headers runs 125* to 130*, with logs, Steady 140*, (150* in the no wake zone).

Closed cooling only adds 40*-50* to the coolant in a single pass, a good radiator will drop the temp +/- 50* (210*- 50*).

You may have issues with sand/silt in the cooling system/logs or sending unit. Should be able to touch, with your hand, the top (t-stat) housing without getting burned while under way (150* will start to hurt) Oil temp usually runs 100*+ over water temp, 220*-240* range

Thats all I got...
Daniel
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79charger

Running pump water line straight to the engine?????

Nixonnow

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IRRebel

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