SoCal Jet Boats
Tech Talk => Engine Mechanical / Electrical => Topic started by: JOE COASTIE on July 24, 2014, 08:52:28 PM
-
so whats the best grade of oil to use? i just been assuming the 10/30 like if it was in a truck or car.
-
so whats the best grade of oil to use? i just been assuming the 10/30 like if it was in a truck or car.
Rather see you use a strait weight, I doubt seriously you will be using the boat in the freezing temperatures... :o
I will attempt to push you toward using 40wt... Do you have a flat tappet camshaft?
If you do, make sure the oil you choose has approximately 1200PPM ZDDP content...
Brad Penn Racing Oil
Joe Gibbs Racing Oil
Valvoline VR1 Racing 40
There are dozens...
Hope that helps...
GT
-
Rather see you use a strait weight, I doubt seriously you will be using the boat in the freezing temperatures... :o
I will attempt to push you toward using 40wt... Do you have a flat tappet camshaft?
If you do, make sure the oil you choose has approximately 1200PPM ZDDP content...
Brad Penn Racing Oil
Joe Gibbs Racing Oil
Valvoline VR1 Racing 40
There are dozens...
Hope that helps...
GT
of course GT always coming thru ...yes on the cam...thank you sir...all ur advice is pretty much why im getting on the water this weekend...👍
Sent from my PantechP9070 using SoCal Jet Boats mobile app
-
That's a very open ended question, oil type is dictated my many factors, fuel type, clearances, useage, temp, cam & lifter style. Just to keep things simple, since I don't think you have an all out racing engine, but marine engines do operate under a load for extended periods of time, I would use a thicker oil, like Valvoline VR1 20w-50 for more protection. Me using a flat tappet cam & lifters I need as much zinc as possible, so I use Cam2 Blue Blood racing oil, it has the highest Zinc content of all oils. I'm not a big fan of synthetic oils, they are good, but the question is, do you really need it?, plus the added cost.
-
That's a very open ended question, oil type is dictated my many factors, fuel type, clearances, useage, temp, cam & lifter style. Just to keep things simple, since I don't think you have an all out racing engine, but marine engines do operate under a load for extended periods of time, I would use a thicker oil, like Valvoline VR1 20w-50 for more protection. Me using a flat tappet cam & lifters I need as much zinc as possible, so I use Cam2 Blue Blood racing oil, it has the highest Zinc content of all oils. I'm not a big fan of synthetic oils, they are good, but the question do you really need it?, plus the added cost.
Just throwing this out there to attempt to start a friendly debate... So you run your boat in 30-40*F weather?
Multi-viscosity oils us polymers to create the different viscosities. These polymers take up the volume of the oil that, while not a large amount, take away the actual lubricating potential. Strait weights in comparison, have none of these polymers, therefore technically trump the snot out of extreme multi-viscosity.
A marine engine is pretty Johnny on the spot when it comes to running oil temperatures, so the lower viscosity will virtually never be utilized.
Just my humble opinion, debate away...
GT
-
As for the cost of synthetics, I analyze my oil in all my vehicles and have literally stretched the oil change interval to almost five times the factory recommended, so it technically pays for itself..
GT
-
Not interested in any debates, we all just post our opinion's on here to try and help others, some are just that, opinions. Others are based on our knowledge, experience and or facts, people can take it, or leave it...
-
Not interested in any debates, we all just post our opinion's on here to try and help others, some are just that, opinions. Others are based on our knowledge, experience and or facts, people can take it, or leave it...
Killjoy... :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:
-
of course GT always coming thru ...yes on the cam...thank you sir...all ur advice is pretty much why im getting on the water this weekend...👍
Sent from my PantechP9070 using SoCal Jet Boats mobile app
did you finally get your starter taken care of? What was the fix?
Sent from my SCH-I545 using SoCal Jet Boats mobile app
-
Delo 400, 15/40
Dan'l
-
Delo 400, 15/40
Dan'l
Careful... Delo will be changing too... Keep your eye on the API circle... BTW, Delo as of right now has about 1300 PPM ZDDP and 1200 PPM phosphorus, good for a broke in motor/cam, not good for breaking in a flat tappet cam... Need to exceed 1800 as Per most camshaft manufacturers. Meaning; you will still need a break in additive.
Just thought I would throw that out there. There really is no Silver Bullet right now.
GT
-
Alway ran 20/50 Lucas oil racing stuff. Nothing better. End of story.
Sent from my iPhone using SoCalJetBoats mobile app
-
Alway ran 20/50 Lucas oil racing stuff. Nothing better. End of story.
Sent from my iPhone using SoCalJetBoats mobile app
Why the split viscosity? Just curious...
GT
-
Careful... Delo will be changing too... Keep your eye on the API circle... BTW, Delo as of right now has about 1300 PPM ZDDP and 1200 PPM phosphorus, good for a broke in motor/cam, not good for breaking in a flat tappet cam... Need to exceed 1800 as Per most camshaft manufacturers. Meaning; you will still need a break in additive.
Just thought I would throw that out there. There really is no Silver Bullet right now.
GT
Always careful, I went roller :thumbup:
Dan'l
-
Always careful, I went roller :thumbup:
Dan'l
Best way to go period....
-
Why the split viscosity? Just curious...
GT
GT, I'm gonna jump in on this thread for a sec here ..
Whats your preference on brand of filter for bbc?
-
Alway ran 20/50 Lucas oil racing stuff. Nothing better. End of story.
Sent from my iPhone using SoCalJetBoats mobile app
You're high as a giraffes ass....
Straight 50wt VR1 for the highest off the shelf zinc content.
What you sacrafice in hp (which ain't much), you will make up in engine life.
-beerjet-
-
did you finally get your starter taken care of? What was the fix?
Sent from my SCH-I545 using SoCal Jet Boats mobile app
oh yes starter issue fixed...i guess new flex plate was all it took cuz i did nothing different with starter except washers on the grade 8 bolts..👍
-
GT, I'm gonna jump in on this thread for a sec here ..
Whats your preference on brand of filter for bbc?
I only really have experience with four manufacturers.
I normally run the Wix XP or Amsoil filters. I know for a fact the NAPA Gold filters are a Wix premium oil filter.. (dad owned a NAPA store for thirty years...).
In the racing days, I was introduced to the K&N oil filters, those things are awesome.
I would not put a Fram oil filter on anything, I have seen them fail too many times.. The base is made of really light material, the filter itself is just paper and cardboard and they look like they were threaded by a guy with a nail file...
Just be mindful that you use different filters for synthetic, than you do with conventional oils. You can get away with a much lower micron count with the synthetic because of its molecular make up (smaller).
After that , I think it is just personal preference...
GT
-
oh yes starter issue fixed...i guess new flex plate was all it took cuz i did nothing different with starter except washers on the grade 8 bolts..👍
nice glad you've got it taken care of. 👍
Sent from my SCH-I545 using SoCal Jet Boats mobile app
-
I'm running Amsoil 10/40 full synthetic in my blower motor. I like the multi grade oil because the 10 weight is much easier on the motor during start up. I'm not trying to push snot through my bearings when the oil's cold. Let's face it, in boating most of us don't properly warm our motors before we go out past the 5mph buoy and hammer the throttle. The big number, 40wt or 50 wt depends on how the motor was built to me. Tighter clearances, I'd run the 40wt, looser, or more precisely looser clearances and more heat as in Jakes race motor I would run a 50wt. Motor clearance and heat are the main determining factors to me on how thick of an oil, viscosity wise, I would run. Straight weight oil is old technology, multi grade's have been what manufacturers have been using for 25 years now. It's also what most major racing teams in organizations like NHRA, Nascar, and USAC, run.
As far as Delo, or Rotella oils go, I know a few guy's that swear by them, but I've also been warned about running them in a motor that's high revving above 4000 rpm as they have a tendency to foam. Foam doesn't pump real well.
Just my Opinion.
-
I'm running Amsoil 10/40 full synthetic in my blower motor. I like the multi grade oil because the 10 weight is much easier on the motor during start up. I'm not trying to push snot through my bearings when the oil's cold. Let's face it, in boating most of us don't properly warm our motors before we go out past the 5mph buoy and hammer the throttle. The big number, 40wt or 50 wt depends on how the motor was built to me. Tighter clearances, I'd run the 40wt, looser, or more precisely looser clearances and more heat as in Jakes race motor I would run a 50wt. Motor clearance and heat are the main determining factors to me on how thick of an oil, viscosity wise, I would run. Straight weight oil is old technology, multi grade's have been what manufacturers have been using for 25 years now. It's also what most major racing teams in organizations like NHRA, Nascar, and USAC, run.
As far as Delo, or Rotella oils go, I know a few guy's that swear by them, but I've also been warned about running them in a motor that's high revving above 4000 rpm as they have a tendency to foam. Foam doesn't pump real well.
Just my Opinion.
Good stuff... :thumbup: FWIW, if they made a 30-50 or even a 40-50, I would probably run it... :sly:
Had some friends swear by Delo in their motorcycles... All of them have had issues. I switched my uncle's race bike over to Amsoil several years ago and the motor has yet to be apart... Smaller engines is where you see bigger things happen faster..
GT
-
I'm running Amsoil 10/40 full synthetic in my blower motor. I like the multi grade oil because the 10 weight is much easier on the motor during start up. I'm not trying to push snot through my bearings when the oil's cold. Let's face it, in boating most of us don't properly warm our motors before we go out past the 5mph buoy and hammer the throttle. The big number, 40wt or 50 wt depends on how the motor was built to me. Tighter clearances, I'd run the 40wt, looser, or more precisely looser clearances and more heat as in Jakes race motor I would run a 50wt. Motor clearance and heat are the main determining factors to me on how thick of an oil, viscosity wise, I would run. Straight weight oil is old technology, multi grade's have been what manufacturers have been using for 25 years now. It's also what most major racing teams in organizations like NHRA, Nascar, and USAC, run.
As far as Delo, or Rotella oils go, I know a few guy's that swear by them, but I've also been warned about running them in a motor that's high revving above 4000 rpm as they have a tendency to foam. Foam doesn't pump real well.
Just my Opinion.
A lot of NASCAR / Sportsman classes run Diesel oils. Of course they run dry sumps, so no issue with foaming. The additives in diesel oil allow it to protect in the dirtiest of environments. Personally I use 15-50 mobile 1, the is the only Mobile 1 with zinc in it. Also as someone mentioned. Test your oil and you'll find that the oil change periods can be pushed out much farther once you get a baseline with the combo of filter and oil you prefer. Here is a site with the most extensive research on oils and filters. Knowledge is the best way to see what suits you. http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/ (http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/)
JW
-
Also, just wanted to throw out there to see if it sticks..
The "W" viscosity is typically rated at -10 degrees F, the higher number rated at 212 degrees F.
This is the only reason I keep preaching closer splits on the weights or stick with a straight weight... When we use our boats, the temperature are normally above 80 degrees... If you do the math, that is only a 132 degree delta, not the 222 degree delta in the spec.
I'm sure it's just semantics at this point, but you straight 40 wt oil will be at 40 within a minute or two..
I do like the thinking though. I still think it's over thought.
In small high performance engines, the Viscosity modifiers break down at a higher rate than the oil itself, this can lead to a false burn, or carbon tinting the oil....
That was where I was going with it..
I spent a lot of time reading about oils and properties of oils when I was laid up after a foot surgery... 8 weeks of not being able to get around to well can expand your cranium.. ;)
GT
-
Man, I agree that this topic can make your head spin with t he more you read. It's like the octane conversation with fuel.. I too have read a ton on these subjects, yet when I try to explain them to someone else it usually sounds more like a 6 year old trying to explain where babies come from. :sly:
I pulled this article off the sight Vintage240zracer posted. It's really close to many others I have read explaining viscosity and oil weights. It's worth the read just to kind of understand how your oil really works in the engine.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/motor-oil-101/ (http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/motor-oil-101/)
-
Man, I agree that this topic can make your head spin with t he more you read. It's like the octane conversation with fuel.. I too have read a ton on these subjects, yet when I try to explain them to someone else it usually sounds more like a 6 year old trying to explain where babies come from. :sly:
I pulled this article off the sight Vintage240zracer posted. It's really close to many others I have read explaining viscosity and oil weights. It's worth the read just to kind of understand how your oil really works in the engine.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/motor-oil-101/ (http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/motor-oil-101/)
The only problem I have with that article is that he is taking into consideration that the clearances and operating temperatures are for an automobile. Cruising down the freeway on a Sunday tour of the wineries in the area.
Now open up the clearances, spin it six times faster and increase the oil temperatures... All the math just went out the drain plug...
When oil is put under the strain that a Jet boat motor can put unto it, you can take virtually any article written for a car and toss it...
JMHO...
BTW, the article is awesome for your family sedan. Your muti-vis is likely not doing what you think it is... here is a test, does your oil pressure stay exactly the same at idle warm or cold... Probably not.
Not saying it is doing any harm at all, just saying it is not necessary.
GT
-
I know it's been a while since anyone has posted here but what about a full synthetic oil? What are the pros and cons of running it?