SoCal Jet Boats
Tech Talk => Engine Mechanical / Electrical => Topic started by: HomeBlown57 on June 06, 2011, 09:13:38 AM
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I have 98% of the parts to go either way so cost and availability are not an issue.
I have an 8-71 with two 1050 dominators lots of pulleys and such.
The other option is twin gt45 turbos. Headers are 90% made I would be using a tunnel ram style intake.
Tell me what you think. The long block is assembled and ready for either intake. 454 eagle H rods new forged crank 7.8-1 MLS head gaskets bowtie aluminum heads.
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It looks like you would be going the EFI route with the turbos with the tunnel ram by the looks of the picture. What tunnel ram is that with the EFI plenum on it, or is it just mocked up with a plenum sitting on top. With Turbos you should run a heat exchanger. I am sure you have see Unchained’s boat with the twins turbos. He made a box with an air to water heat exchanger that is after the throttle bodies mounted on a box on top of an EFI edlebrock dominator flange intake.
See the EFI build up for my blower in my signature. Carbs are nice but EFI on a blower is cool too. Blowers also look cool and mean but the turbos will make more power (many pros and cons about this but I will not get into that).
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It is a manufactured tunnel ram with the plenum. No decisions have been made. I know that there is more power in the turbos, but simplicity in the blower. I would not be running the efi if I ran the blower. I feel the efi complications are only worth the hassle if I use the turbos. Since you are Blown, I assume that you would suggest the blower?
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injected blower please...
Rough Idle (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SoGV6eZ5srk&feature=related#)
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I think TJ hit on the head, Blower makes good power and have a "WOW" factor of 10......Where as the TT set up has the potential to make a stupid >:D amount power with a WOW factor of 5 or 6......example: Everyone has seen a BIG polished blower, over sized pulleys, big over sized belt, It screams....."I have a small penis" (thats why I built a blower motor :'() On the other hand the average person does not even know what a Turbo is or how it works for that matter. What it SAYS is: "I'm packing a 2x4 in my shorts.....don't f*#k with me!"
Seriously thou, knowing you, performance is by far #1 and there is no question......TURBO'S! Besides, there is already 1 blower boat in the neighbor hood, now we need a turbo boat!
P.S. I am sure there is a juicy sig. line in there for someone.
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sorry i couldnt hear anything dirty air said over the sound of this BLOWER...
1,200 HP Blown Injected Biesemeyer Jet Boat (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HFNfH_EY9J8#)
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Turbos , no question about it!
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My thoughts have always been that a blower says "I'm serious" an 8-71 says "I'm REAL serious" but twin turbos large enough to pass a large cat say "are YOU serious?"
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Put it this way. If I build another jet boat it will be turbo charged EFI intercooled. At the sandbar where
I hung out there were people always around the boat asking where I got this and got that. When I told
them I made most of the stuff the wow factor turned to the holy shit factor. I think the wifes breasts may
have added to the wow factor too. LOL.
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TJS you have one of these, don't you? This is Jethro.
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Maybe that was nordic454.
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No that would be Tank ;)
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Who does Tank own?
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Or you could go this route! >:D
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Who does Tank own?
Tank owns Nordic454 and MrsNordic454 ;D
Or you could go this route! >:D
as of lately this has been my most favorite route! That boat just looks mean...wonder if it is capable of sucking up the drivers left arm?
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that boat just ran back to back 7.09's in the quarter mile , while dumping the throttle at the 1000 foot mark. He claims it makes 1850 with the set up it has but is capable of alot more.
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Somethin about a blown Big Block.
BBC EFI Blown Jet Boat Boost (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFZ-bGrY61c#)
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Blown Daytona vs Blown Nordic.
Daytona - Nordic Connecticut River (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MftTt7o5vWI&NR=1#)
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I vote blower because of how easy iit would be. Save the big turbos for the 572 and the 57.
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I have chosen short term to run a single Holley to break in the new engine. I think it will be very simple with no complications. I have ran the carb and ignition system before.
I am leaning heavily toward the turbos!
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sorry id thought i would put my two cents in. id use the blower, turbos are really touchy!!! my step dad ran a turbo in his jeep for years!!!!! loved it , but when things went bad omg it went really wrong. the biggest prob is the detonation !!! with a turbo the boost can kick on and there you go! and a couple grand later your back and ready to go again. Then there is always the cool factor !!! nothing looks better then a well designed turbo system!!!! either way good luck!
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I put the turbo headers on this week and threw the blower over the fence into the neighbors yard!
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I put the turbo headers on this week and threw the blower over the fence into the neighbors yard!
:screwy:
Ray
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damn,, i gotta 16-71 sittin in my closet!!! this makes me wanna break it out!! now i just need someone to put it together :screwy:
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I put the turbo headers on this week and threw the blower over the fence into the neighbors yard!
You thought you threw it over the fence....I was on the other side with a baseball mit and caught it! never touched the ground!
I did not to be the first to tell you, but the headers are on backwards! :screwy: LOL!......oh wait, thats for in the winter they act like a heater O0
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You thought you threw it over the fence....I was on the other side with a baseball mit and caught it! never touched the ground!
I did not to be the first to tell you, but the headers are on backwards! :screwy: LOL!......oh wait, thats for in the winter they act like a heater O0
Nah, I think he's gonna use the hairdryers for....well......Hairdryers! >:D
Ray
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It looks like I am going to run the blower for a bit. The season is closing in hard and the EFI stuff is a little behind schedule. The knuckle dragger blower crap is easy and quick and cheap. So what if I lose 300-400 extra horsepower. 50's technology reigns supreme today. I guess 650HP on the lake is better than a dry boat in the garage any day of the week!
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Who does Tank own?
Meet Tank
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Being blown is a good wow factor, but I think its really hard to beat the WOW factor of a good looking efi turbo setup. If I had the dough, there would be no question that I would do it in a heatbeat
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Nice
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That piece of crap is back on the shelf where it belongs! It was a big waste of time! I am back to the turbo project.
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That piece of crap is back on the shelf where it belongs! It was a big waste of time! I am back to the turbo project.
I'll be glad to to give that "piece of crap" a nice home so it doesnt mess up your shelf. ;)
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My thoughts have always been that a blower says "I'm serious" an 8-71 says "I'm REAL serious" but twin turbos large enough to pass a large cat say "are YOU serious?"
How 'bout a turbo nearly the size of a berk pump
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turbo lag from hell but youll get 60psi lol
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That piece of crap is back on the shelf where it belongs! It was a big waste of time! I am back to the turbo project.
What happened?
Ray
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I put the blower on because I was thinking that the turbo project wasn't going to get finished by the end of the season. I THOUGHT that the blower would bolt on and with a few jet changes I would be up and running. After I took it out 5 times each time the plugs were lean and each time I jetted it up. When I took it off, I had 108 jets in it and it was still lean (reading the plugs). The carbs are 1050 dominators. The setup at a light cruise would occasionally pop the blow off. I ran the timing between 32 and 38. The last time out I set the timing at 36, then while I was out I jacked it back and forth in small stages too far both ways.
It would idle fine.
Mashing it to rev it up fine. (occasionally popping the blow off)
Light cruise (84,85 jets popped bad, 95,96 rarely popped, 108,108 slight popping)
Full throttle (84,85 labored at top end, 95,96 ran good but still WAY short on power, 108,108 still WAY short on power)
Plugs showed lean each time. Each run I would full throttle for 1/2 mile then do a full throttle shutdown. Bowls were checked twice at the full throttle shut down and found to be full.
I believe the carbs are not getting enough signal to the boosters. They are not annular boosters. If I were to chase the problem I would change to carbs with annular boosters. If this setup is what I really wanted to run I would have continued to chase it, but it was supposed to be a quick fix to get the boat wet. It turned out to be a big waste of time.
I will entertain any ideas. But keep in mind;
It idled fine. (no vacuum leak)
The bowls were full after a long full throttle shutdown. (fuel pump and bowl levels are good)
Plugs are lean, all 8 are identical. (108 jets)
The metering blocks are supposedly limited to about a 102 jet.
I have built 7 blow through boost referenced carbs. I have had holleys from 600-950 on my car. I know my way around a Holley. I am not saying that I know everything, I am just saying that I am not new to tuning a Holley.
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I put the blower on because I was thinking that the turbo project wasn't going to get finished by the end of the season. I THOUGHT that the blower would bolt on and with a few jet changes I would be up and running. After I took it out 5 times each time the plugs were lean and each time I jetted it up. When I took it off, I had 108 jets in it and it was still lean (reading the plugs). The carbs are 1050 dominators. The setup at a light cruise would occasionally pop the blow off. I ran the timing between 32 and 38. The last time out I set the timing at 36, then while I was out I jacked it back and forth in small stages too far both ways.
It would idle fine.
Mashing it to rev it up fine. (occasionally popping the blow off)
Light cruise (84,85 jets popped bad, 95,96 rarely popped, 108,108 slight popping)
Full throttle (84,85 labored at top end, 95,96 ran good but still WAY short on power, 108,108 still WAY short on power)
Plugs showed lean each time. Each run I would full throttle for 1/2 mile then do a full throttle shutdown. Bowls were checked twice at the full throttle shut down and found to be full.
I believe the carbs are not getting enough signal to the boosters. They are not annular boosters. If I were to chase the problem I would change to carbs with annular boosters. If this setup is what I really wanted to run I would have continued to chase it, but it was supposed to be a quick fix to get the boat wet. It turned out to be a big waste of time.
I will entertain any ideas. But keep in mind;
It idled fine. (no vacuum leak)
The bowls were full after a long full throttle shutdown. (fuel pump and bowl levels are good)
Plugs are lean, all 8 are identical. (108 jets)
The metering blocks are supposedly limited to about a 102 jet.
I have built 7 blow through boost referenced carbs. I have had holleys from 600-950 on my car. I know my way around a Holley. I am not saying that I know everything, I am just saying that I am not new to tuning a Holley.
Just thinking out loud here, you running a velocity stack or a scoop?
Also, I think 36* timing is too hot, I would have figured closer to 30*BTDC...Anyone? :-\
This sure sounds like a valve timing issue. But literally throwing darts at an open widow.... :sly:
My original thought was not enough air velocity across the boosters causing them to flow very little fuel, hence the question about the stacks/scoop...(The blow across a soda straw analogy.)
Never, ever give up......Unless your wife says to. ;D
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