SoCal Jet Boats
Tech Talk => Engine Mechanical / Electrical => Topic started by: Handi-Crack on August 31, 2014, 02:11:30 PM
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So looking around and there are so many options and I'm confused about what I should be looking for. Not sure what brands I should stay away from and what ones are safe bets.
I'm over thinking all of it and just want it back on the water any suggestions for a 455?
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Buy a running 455 there is always a lot of them around!
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I have everything just need connecting rods pistons all bearings and have the crank fixed.
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eBay for the rods, I have read a lot on rods buy a good set.
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If money was no object, Modello...
You will likely be buying a kit form someone like Summit or Jegs.
If you have a machine shop, sometimes they can get the parts through their preferred vendors..
All that being said, there should be good used parts all over the place.
GT
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Look if you have not done anything but pull your motor apart then look around for a good used motor! There is always someone that is looking to get rid if there's to go to a chevy or ford cause they have been told the olds is crap! So the season is almost up, bide your time and buy a complete motor that you can hear run. It will be cheaper for you!!' You can run your heads or what ever you want on it. Have someone go with you that knows motors.
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It's a rebuilt motor I'm starting with wasting money on a motor I'd have to make work is cash wasted.
I don't get the logic
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A couple thoughts here. First, what exactly is your budget? If you have a couple thousand dollars you can find the parts you need and take them to a good builder and have something assembled the way you want it. What is in your boat's future? Is it going to be something you want to keep for decades, or can you see yourself looking for something bigger or nicer in a few years. If you don't think you will have it forever, I would switch to a BBC because you will have a much harder time selling an Olds powered boat to anyone else. If you decide to build the Olds drawbacks are going to be that the shop has to be trustworthy and quality oriented. You will still be on the hook for final tuning and break in unless you want to pay for that stuff too. Money well spent IMHO.
Another route (the cheap ass bastard method) is start searching the old school wrecking yards and/or Hemmings for a Toronado motor. They are the only Olds motors that got the good stuff every time. Gutlesses, 442s etc. some did some didn't. Olds motors are very simple to build as you don't have all that many choices for parts on the cheap. E-brock heads are not worth the money, OEM rods and cranks are fine, pistons are cheap, but there is some exotic valve train hardware available. Then put it together over the winter months, saving undue damage to your wallet.
But let's be honest here. You are never going to beat anyone in a drag race, and you are always going to be having to keep an eye on your oil pressure. I was in your situation a while back and I was able to find an almost new motor with roller rockers, forged pistons and N crank, and big oil pan for $500 from another member here. I could still see the hatch marks on the cylinders ! Honestly if I was in your shoes I would probably scavenge up the parts and ship them off to a builder here in So Cal or AZ that has decades of experience with jet boat motors. Someone who will be willing to spend some time on the water if need be with you. Carb tuning, timing, etc are all qiute different in a boat sometimes because of the load they operate under. Talk to those guys on RealOldsPower.com, they will be able to help you if you need stuff.
And remember always that "Good ain't cheap, and cheap ain't good." The low bidder is not usually looking out for you first before themself. Proceed accordingly.
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I will never pay someone to build me a motor again I will be doing the build. I have a machine shop to check the crank and block before I start.
I have seen kits for 678 to 2100+ so I will put another 500 or so for a new carb.
I want a relible motor to last another 3 years as I build a new motor (most likely a SBC Stroker) to go into a 19 footer.
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Ok how much do you have to spend??? The logic is this if you find a motor that is in great shape you won't have to touch it just put it in. You wanting to rebuild yours is nice but if you do one wrong thing you could be out ! And I mean it all! I have been around a shop my whole life. Changing your oil is Not building an engine. It's not for a beginner . Ask how many on here have actually put there boat motor together. Then ask if it still works! Not trying to talk you out of it , but to understand what getting into.
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^^^ Exactly what I was thinking ^^^
That is why I mentioned paying to have it broken in by a shop. There are probably 75 different measurements involved, which frequently means correct down to the hundred thousandth of an inch. Many of these measurements need to be done before you order any parts. Has your block ever been cut? Heads milled? Pistons in or out of the hole? That crank that you want to salvage, it does have a big ass N cast on it right? What heads are you going to run, there are about 6 to choose from. If you happen to have a set of "C" castings already you can sell them for enough $$$ to finance your whole build. If they are "J" like mine were, you are screwed my friend. Do you really have enough patience to index and file a couple dozen piston rings and do you have all the specialized tools like valve spring compressor, crank dial indicator, scales etc. because you are going to need them.
There is no harsher environment for that 455 than putting it in a jet boat. A sloppy or poorly designed build that might pass on the street in your Grandpa's Cutlass won't last one season pulling tubes and late afternoon speed runs.
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Tools are not an issue and time isn't an issue as well. I took the whole motor apart with help from a friend nieghbor and tons on research online and books.everything is numbered or punched bagged and labeled.
So what I'm getting is to forget what I have and start fresh with a 454 block. If so I guess I can get 100 bucks for what I have.
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454 or 455 isn't really the issue. Putting the parts in the right places is only half the battle. A true "builder" makes sure every one of those parts fits together perfectly. Every part gets filed, weighed, shaved, lubed, trial fit, and massaged so that they all work in perfect balance. Nothing fits good enough right out of the box, NOTHING. You literally have to measure everything with a micrometer and MAKE the parts fit perfectly. Books are not going to emphasize this nearly enough.
If I can find Timminator's article I will send you a link. At least then you will be able to get a glimpse into just how many different ways there are to build a BBO.
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I'm down to read it and hey, if you don't do how can you learn.
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Time on the water and $$$ are both real hard to come by IMO. When I have to DEPEND on my boat running all of the time, I figure letting a pro do it the first and only time is a better allocation of resources, than me constantly chasing little problems and never having complete confidence. It sucks always boating upriver so if you have problems you can float back. I've been that guy too. I don't like it.
This article wasn't scanned in a way to make it easy to read, but as you read through it notice all of the different things that CAN be done. Everyone is going to build a motor different, but Tim lays out info in a way that lets you decide just how much time and effort CAN be spent putting a boat motor together. Blueprinting a motor takes a lot of time. Only you can decide how much time and effort you want to put into this thing.
http://www.vintagejetboats.com/showthread.php?6963-Hot-Boat-Mag-June-2006-quot-Pratical-455-Olds-quot-build-article (http://www.vintagejetboats.com/showthread.php?6963-Hot-Boat-Mag-June-2006-quot-Pratical-455-Olds-quot-build-article)
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http://www.summitracing.com/parts/fem-csmhp822-011 (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/fem-csmhp822-011)
Would this kit work just to get it running?
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On EBay, there's a shop selling a set of Eagle H-beam 6.735"steel rods for BBO for under or around $100.00. I run them in 468" that's pushing around 575hp (BBO).
I built my own only reusing the "N" crank and block. They're reliable, and powerful. Look for a book by Bill Travato (BTR Performance), Dick Miller Racing, Mondello, Rocket Racing.
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