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clayBBF

  • Karma: +0/-0
Why are there no hemi’s
« on: March 07, 2020, 06:28:49 PM »
Just a random thought. Why aren’t there more hemi powered jets out there. I’ve only seen a few on YouTube. Is there a Specific reason why more people don’t use them??


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bahner80

  • Karma: +16/-0
Re: Why are there no hemi’s
« Reply #1 on: March 07, 2020, 08:42:43 PM »
Price???
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K-034

  • Karma: +23/-0
Re: Why are there no hemi’s
« Reply #2 on: March 09, 2020, 05:02:17 AM »
There is a guy in Havasu building a place craft with an Arias in it, Chevy hemi


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ELCHINGONROGERS

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Re: Why are there no hemi’s
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2020, 06:37:23 PM »
Hemis are $$$$


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  • Boat #1: 1978 rogers boniville
  • Boat #2: 2005 tpr stealth
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OutofTouch

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Re: Why are there no hemi’s
« Reply #4 on: March 12, 2020, 07:28:34 PM »
I've got a 19' Eliminator Formula with a 500 inch HEMI. Put the engine together back in the 80's. Had a friend that raced a Pro Stock when 500 inch engines were just starting out. Bought one of his rotating assemblies when he went a different direction. As said above, costs a bunch to build. I did some quick figuring and it would cost some where between 10,000 and 11,000 just for parts new then add in the machine work and assembly.

I am going to start going some restoration work on the boat starting this summer, my errors $$$$.

Once completed, I want to trailer it down to River for one or two of the seasonal SoCal events.

Bob
  • Boat #1: 1984 Eliminator Formula
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TrollerDave

  • Karma: +32/-0
Re: Why are there no hemi’s
« Reply #5 on: March 12, 2020, 07:49:38 PM »
I've got a 19' Eliminator Formula with a 500 inch HEMI. Put the engine together back in the 80's. Had a friend that raced a Pro Stock when 500 inch engines were just starting out. Bought one of his rotating assemblies when he went a different direction. As said above, costs a bunch to build. I did some quick figuring and it would cost some where between 10,000 and 11,000 just for parts new then add in the machine work and assembly.

I am going to start going some restoration work on the boat starting this summer, my errors $$$$.

Once completed, I want to trailer it down to River for one or two of the seasonal SoCal events.

Bob
Sounds cool. Do you have any pics. The Formula is a good looking hull.


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clayBBF

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Re: Why are there no hemi’s
« Reply #6 on: March 13, 2020, 12:13:41 PM »
That would be awesome Bob! So it seems the only reason people aren’t using them is because the cheddar .


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Flusher

  • Karma: +84/-0
Re: Why are there no hemi’s
« Reply #7 on: March 13, 2020, 05:02:54 PM »
I understand that there are some limitations to hemispherical combustion chamber compared to that of a canted valve wedge head while in a naturally aspirated application.

My research indicates that a tight quench and modern combustion chamber design produces a highly turbulent air/fuel mixture motion as the piston approaches TDC on the compression stroke.  This turbulence increases homogenization of the air and fuel, increasing burn rate, producing a more complete burn, reducing timing advance requirements, and increasing resistance to detonation.

In a power adder application, that may not necessarily be true.  Softening of the combustion chamber on BBC heads, making them more Hemi-like, apparently broadens the tuning window.

Hemi heads have some distinct advantages in the airflow department.  For example, because the valves open directly towards the center of the combustion chamber, the valves move away from the cylinder walls as lift increases.  Hemi valves are never shrouded.  Line-of-sight port/valve layout, when you look down the ports of a Hemi, you can see right down into the combustion chamber.  However, modern technology in canted valve wedge heads has surpassed the former advantage of the Hemi head.

Because of the shape of the Hemi ports, airflow tumbles into the combustion chamber like a waterfall.  Swirl was a big buzzword back in the 80s and 90s.  Now, head porters try to achieve quality flow.  Some swirl is beneficial while the valve is open, and can continue in the combustion chamber after the valve closes. Tumble motion stops immediately after the valve closes.

I have always had a thing for Hemis.  Even though there are limitations to Hemi architecture, at the level that I would be building my own engines at, I would still love to have one in my boat.  I may opt for a set of Arias heads.
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clayBBF

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Why are there no hemi’s
« Reply #8 on: March 16, 2020, 06:08:06 AM »
Thanks flusher! I didn’t know any of that info.


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OutofTouch

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Re: Why are there no hemi’s
« Reply #9 on: March 17, 2020, 02:07:17 PM »
Agreed, Thanks Flusher for the additional information on the engine/head design. I do know that the design, flow allows for about an additional point in compression before detonation but is hard to get to above 13 to 1. On a different direction Flusher, can I build a transom plate with a 4" set-back pump? I really like the idea of the clean out on the outside of the boat.

These are the only pictures of the boat I could find, thought I had more saved on my other computer.

I have a lot of work to do for the restoration, seats, carpet, jell work(my mistake), and to go through the engine.

I still like the HEMI, Mopar is in my blood.

Bob
  • Boat #1: 1984 Eliminator Formula
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Flusher

  • Karma: +84/-0
Re: Why are there no hemi’s
« Reply #10 on: March 18, 2020, 05:48:27 AM »


On a different direction Flusher, can I build a transom plate with a 4" set-back pump? I really like the idea of the clean out on the outside of the boat.

When you say, "With a 4" set-back," that depends largely on where you are measuring the 4 inches.  Typically a setback would be measured from the back edge of the shoe (covered by the ride plate) to the transom.  We usually shot for 1-1.5 inches beyond the transom.  Too much further back and air can be sucked in from the transom area.

The relationship between the hand hole cover and the transom is largely dependent on the angle of the transom relative to the keel.  Some are close to 90-degrees and some have quite a bit of angle.  This angle is relief to help removal from the mold.

If the hand hole is beyond the transom, plates are very straight forward.  If the hand hole cover protrudes into the transom cutout, you can fabricate a box around the cover.

The short answer would have been, yes.

If you would like to start a thread, you would get a lot more detailed information.
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Flusher

  • Karma: +84/-0
Re: Why are there no hemi’s
« Reply #11 on: March 18, 2020, 06:26:54 AM »
Another speculation about why the Hemi is not more predominant is, "Hemi" is trademarked by Chrysler Corporation (http://tmsearch.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=4810:etpg9w.4.96).  Chrysler was absolutely psycho about use of their trademarked names, even going so far as to sue car owners clubs for using, for example, "Cuda" in the name.

From my understanding, the Keith Black blocks and heads were the first to be produced and were actually licensed production.

The modern Hemi is really only a Hemi in name only as quench area has been added to the chambers and is therefore not a true hemispheric shape.
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OutofTouch

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Re: Why are there no hemi’s
« Reply #12 on: March 18, 2020, 07:19:26 PM »
Thanks Flusher

I was going to start another thread. Probably won't be for another 1 1/2 to 2 months before I can getup back to the cabin (snow on the ground and salt still on the roads until the first part of May). Really didn't want to hi-jack the thread. I am actually going to start a number of threads as I have some question on the restore and about the River.

Chrysler has been real picky about using anything that relates to them, product or name I know years ago, Dynacorn was going to add a Cuda body to their list of repops, even had it advertised on their site and then one day it was gone. They went after a number of companies back in the late 80's when restorations took off for making replacement parts. It was one of those if you want to play, then you are going to have to pay.

Hemi's were a low volume production product. There were never a lot of parts flowing thru the used parts market compared to Chevrolet or  Ford. Chrysler wasn't the only one that went after Trademark names, Ford did the same thing. I know of several web sites that had to change their name because they had the name "Ferd" in their name. One wold think that they would be happy to have there name out and about. But I can also see their side with all of the bootleg parts that were and still are coming into the country. I'm sure they don't want to be involved in a lawsuit if something happened with a bootleg part.

Bob
« Last Edit: March 18, 2020, 07:26:24 PM by OutofTouch »
  • Boat #1: 1984 Eliminator Formula
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camshaw

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Re: Why are there no hemi’s
« Reply #13 on: May 06, 2020, 01:58:53 PM »
price and availability...Ive owned 3 426 hemi motors and currenlty own two 392 hemis from  1957 that are going into my 32 ford coupes...Im currenlty collecting parts for another 426hemi for my 68 dodge charger...blocks are hard to find and overpriced, heads u can get directly from edelbrock.....Ive got a oem magnesium xram and oem rockers and crank and still need a block and heads to complete the motor.....chevys are cheap and all over and they sold tons of them, hemis cost mopar three times the cost of a wedge motor to build so they are rare, but still out there, alot of old guys are dieing off and stuff is coming out of hiding but the younger generations have no interest in the stuff and just want LS motors with AC....lol.........cameron......ps...... ...im still looking for old hemi parts
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