SoCal Jet Boats

Tech Talk => Jet Pumps => Topic started by: SuperDuty on February 28, 2010, 08:23:26 PM

Title: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: SuperDuty on February 28, 2010, 08:23:26 PM
Since Im new to this whole Jet boat experience, Iv been reading alot to figure out what to buy. I have a few questions though.. Like whats the difference between an A impeller and a B? Why are some made of bronze and some stainless? Also, I found some headers for a BBC and was wondering if its a good deal or not. Theyre basset with the ports in the bottom for water, but no lines. They're shorter than most of the headers Iv seen and a little beat up, will need a refinish. But moneys tight and the guy wants $200. Worth it? Thanks in advance for any info!
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: Luckie Stiff on February 28, 2010, 08:28:09 PM
Since Im new to this whole Jet boat experience, Iv been reading alot to figure out what to buy. I have a few questions though.. Like whats the difference between an A impeller and a B? Why are some made of bronze and some stainless? Also, I found some headers for a BBC and was wondering if its a good deal or not. Theyre basset with the ports in the bottom for water, but no lines. They're shorter than most of the headers Iv seen and a little beat up, will need a refinish. But moneys tight and the guy wants $200. Worth it? Thanks in advance for any info!

Not sure why the diff between bronze and stainless, I think you're best bet is to stick with the A cut impeller, most boats out there like the A, think of the impeller like the 3rd member in your car, the A is probably close to a 3.70 gear, B is 3.83, C is 4.11, D is 4.56 none of those are factual, but they'll give you an idea how it works.

The headers, $200, beat up with no water lines? Pass- There's always BBC headers available, 300 to 350 is the going rate, usually including water lines.

Your best money spent will be on a Place Diverter, hands down the best bang for your buck you can get.

Keep 'em coming, I'm here all week!
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: SuperDuty on February 28, 2010, 08:33:02 PM
The boat I just bought has a hydraulic diverter. Theres a guy in town selling a droop snoot. Im going to be running a very mild 454 as soon as I find one with some chrome for looks, so is the droop even helpful? Thanks for the explanation of the impellers. Thats what I figured they did, but wasnt sure at all.
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: Luckie Stiff on February 28, 2010, 08:37:48 PM
Yes, a droop should help lift your boat out of the water, I'd buy it if you can get it cheap enough (less than $175) otherwise buy a new one.
There's quite a few good BBC for sale, what's your $$$ range??
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: IRRebel on February 28, 2010, 08:45:05 PM
I wouldn't worry about, or use bling as a reason to buy or not buy an engine. Just get a good one and be done with it. I'm willing to bet you can PM nearly any one of us and we all have various pieces of BBC "Bling" we'd gladly give away in some cases, and with a lil elbow grease, will shine up just fine. I got V/C's all over the place, and I see polished intakes on here quite often in the $100-$150 ish range. Brads got a real nice scoop and carb right now.......etc,etc.... ;D

X2 on the Diverter!  ;) But you already got one! If the Droops a smoking deal, I'd buy it just to try it. It'll either help or hurt, kinda like that with them. Just gotta try it with and without it. You can always resell it.

Ray

Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: SuperDuty on February 28, 2010, 08:57:50 PM
Yah, Im looking for a BB then buying the bling later. Found a stock 454 locally with casting out of a early 70s Chevelle for 400 bucks. Iv been eyeballing Brads carb and scoop, just have to make sure Im getting the motor first. Moneys been real tight lately cause of the weather and I do dirt work for a living, not mud work! Going back at it tomorrow though, plus Im taking my Rhino to a guy for a test ride and hopfully some extra boat money. As soon as I get cash, this site will be the first to know! I gotta get this boat goin!
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: GT Jets on February 28, 2010, 09:21:49 PM
Since Im new to this whole Jet boat experience, Iv been reading alot to figure out what to buy. I have a few questions though.. Like whats the difference between an A impeller and a B?
The difference without getting too deep is the length of the vanes, a longer vane means it will move more water per revolution, absorbing more HP and theoretically more water

Why are some made of bronze and some stainless?
Primarily cost, the stainless impellers are difficult and expensive to do but very very strong, a bronze is much easier to cast, but stronger than an aluminum.

Also, I found some headers for a BBC and was wondering if its a good deal or not. Theyre basset with the ports in the bottom for water, but no lines. They're shorter than most of the headers Iv seen and a little beat up, will need a refinish. But moneys tight and the guy wants $200. Worth it?

It costs a buttload of dough to "refinish" a set of headers, shorties if used with water will make a huge mess of the back of the boat. :thumbdown:

GT
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: Bebo on February 28, 2010, 11:32:17 PM
PM Sent
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: SuperDuty on March 01, 2010, 07:29:34 PM
Well, Sold the Rhino today. Sad to watch it leave but now I have boat cash! Picked up the 454 for 300 bones. Now the fun begins. Need a few things.. but what else do you guys recomend getting? So far its valve covers, intake/carb, scoop, high quart oil pan.. I think Im going to need a bellhousing and whatever parts connect the motor to the U-Joints on the jet. Id also like to get the motor rails to make it easier to pull later on. I have engine plates. Need a distributor, buy expensive or buy factory Chev? Iv heard alot about getting a cam.. your thought on that? It looks like I have all waterlines to hook up the motor. Anything else off the top of your heads?
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: Luckie Stiff on March 01, 2010, 08:18:46 PM
Well, Sold the Rhino today. Sad to watch it leave but now I have boat cash! Picked up the 454 for 300 bones. Now the fun begins. Need a few things.. but what else do you guys recomend getting? So far its valve covers, intake/carb, scoop, high quart oil pan.. I think Im going to need a bellhousing and whatever parts connect the motor to the U-Joints on the jet. Id also like to get the motor rails to make it easier to pull later on. I have engine plates. Need a distributor, buy expensive or buy factory Chev? Iv heard alot about getting a cam.. your thought on that? It looks like I have all waterlines to hook up the motor. Anything else off the top of your heads?

Ok, here's what I'd be buying if it was me:

10 Quart jet boat oil pan- Summit sells a nice Hamburger's pan for $220 http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HAM-1498/ (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HAM-1498/)

Rail kit, contact Ironman here on the boards, he makes them, he's in Clovis so you could just pop down the hill and pick a set up.

I run a Mallory Unilite Distributor w/ Pro Master coil, I love it. Others like MSD shit, it's up to you really, just avoid Pro Comp at all costs. http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MAA-3748201/ (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MAA-3748201/)

Cam- Comp Cams makes a nice 292/292 K kit http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-K11-213-3/ (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-K11-213-3/)

Intake manifold- Very nice knock off of a Victor Jr. I've seen some of these intakes, and other than the fact that there's no brand name on them, they're as close to identical as I could tell. Talked to a few guys that own them, they love them, they work good, and they're priced right. http://www.summitracing.com/parts/PFS-53036/?rtype=10 (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/PFS-53036/?rtype=10)

Minimum 850 mechanical secondary carb. Holley or QFT http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HLY-0-82851/ (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HLY-0-82851/)

Melling high volume oil pump http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MEL-M77HV/ (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MEL-M77HV/)

Rewarder or Bassett headers.

Have fun!

Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: SuperDuty on March 01, 2010, 08:31:31 PM
Wow, Thanks for taking the time to find the links for me! Really appreciate that! Im hoping to find the intake and carb stuff used. I see alot of it on here. Im trying to get on the water as cheap as possible this season. Would you say the oil pan is a must?
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: Luckie Stiff on March 01, 2010, 08:39:22 PM
no, my boat had  a stock truck 8 qt for a long time before I spent the $$ on a 10 qt. If you're looking for good quality used parts, call Jim @ Cyclone Marine, it's in my signature line, he'll set you right.
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: SuperDuty on March 01, 2010, 09:00:05 PM
Cool. The pan I have is out of a truck. Looks pretty big. I know the more oil the better, but Im just trying to go for the essentials for the time being.
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: GT Jets on March 01, 2010, 09:10:59 PM
Cool. The pan I have is out of a truck. Looks pretty big. I know the more oil the better, but Im just trying to go for the essentials for the time being.

You will need to check the depth, a jet with a standard driveline can have clearance issues.

I like the Dooley pans and have seen them priced right used.. :thumbup:  But Hamburgers are prettier.  ;)

GT
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: Marcsrollin on March 01, 2010, 09:36:20 PM
Well, Sold the Rhino today. Sad to watch it leave but now I have boat cash! Picked up the 454 for 300 bones. Now the fun begins. Need a few things.. but what else do you guys recomend getting? So far its valve covers, intake/carb, scoop, high quart oil pan.. I think Im going to need a bellhousing and whatever parts connect the motor to the U-Joints on the jet. Id also like to get the motor rails to make it easier to pull later on. I have engine plates. Need a distributor, buy expensive or buy factory Chev? Iv heard alot about getting a cam.. your thought on that? It looks like I have all waterlines to hook up the motor. Anything else off the top of your heads?


Just off the top of my head , It is a BBC so the number to vessel assist will most likely come in to play sooner or later! ;D
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: SuperDuty on March 01, 2010, 09:41:10 PM
Vessel assist? Isnt that what beer is for? Ill be the one with the sign that says "Will pay beer for a tow"  :thumbup:
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: GT Jets on March 01, 2010, 09:43:46 PM

Just off the top of my head , It is a BBC so the number to vessel assist will most likely come in to play sooner or later! ;D


Yeah, they could always use the help of another Chevy powered boat to pull broken Fords out of the river.... ;)

Don't let him get into your head SuperDuty  :thumbup:

GT
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: SuperDuty on March 01, 2010, 10:04:50 PM
Oh I wont.. Tow rig might be a ford, but Im still Chevy at heart! I just sent a bunch of PM for parts I found in the classifieds. Alot of em were old posts though. Hopefully a few will pan out atleast. The ignition system looks like it will be the most expensive thing for this motor.
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: SuperDuty on March 02, 2010, 07:26:05 PM
Started to tear into the motor today... Got this casting number off the heads, 346236, I looked em up and it says open chamber peanut ports.. I have a feeling that isnt good. That also means that Im going to have to get an intake for round port correct?
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: Luckie Stiff on March 02, 2010, 07:28:42 PM
Started to tear into the motor today... Got this casting number off the heads, 346236, I looked em up and it says open chamber peanut ports.. I have a feeling that isnt good. That also means that Im going to have to get an intake for round port correct?

That or dump those peanut ports for something better.
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: IRRebel on March 03, 2010, 09:13:49 AM
You will need to check the depth, a jet with a standard driveline can have clearance issues.

I like the Dooley pans and have seen them priced right used.. :thumbup:  But Hamburgers are prettier.  ;)

GT

I love the Dooley pan on the Pickle! PLENTY of clearance compared to the Milodon I put on Moo, but man are they pricey! This is the first I'm hearing on the Hamburger pans. Would love to see some detailed pics of one.

Looks like all good suggestions. Yeah, I would dump the heads and find some 990's or better. Ton's of good oval ports out there and can run with the best of 'em. Here's a pretty good deal I was lookin at for myself!

http://phoenix.craigslist.org/evl/pts/1624577413.html

Rect ports are great, but bring a fat wallet for the good ones. Personally, unless you are restoring a classic 'Vette or Chevelle, I'd leave 'em be and go aluminum.

Ray
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: GT Jets on March 03, 2010, 01:33:29 PM
I love the Dooley pan on the Pickle! PLENTY of clearance compared to the Milodon I put on Moo, but man are they pricey! This is the first I'm hearing on the Hamburger pans. Would love to see some detailed pics of one.

Looks like all good suggestions. Yeah, I would dump the heads and find some 990's or better. Ton's of good oval ports out there and can run with the best of 'em. Here's a pretty good deal I was lookin at for myself!

http://phoenix.craigslist.org/evl/pts/1624577413.html

Rect ports are great, but bring a fat wallet for the good ones. Personally, unless you are restoring a classic 'Vette or Chevelle, I'd leave 'em be and go aluminum.

Ray

990's on flattop pistons no bueno.. :thumbdown:

I have the heads you need for flattops...Find out what pistons you have or are going to use, I think the heads you have will "work" but you can do better..Oval port heads are torque friendly....Rectangles are RPM friendly... :thumbup:
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: Luckie Stiff on March 03, 2010, 03:35:44 PM
990's on flattop pistons no bueno.. :thumbdown:

I have the heads you need for flattops...Find out what pistons you have or are going to use, I think the heads you have will "work" but you can do better..Oval port heads are torque friendly....Rectangles are RPM friendly... :thumbup:

Please tell me why my 990 rectangle port heads aren't good on my Arias flat top pistons. Seems to be working for me.
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: beerjet on March 04, 2010, 09:38:54 AM
6272990....70-up...rect...OPEN...454 service replacement, used on some MKIV crate engines, 118cc chamber

That is a big chamber for flat tops.
Your compression must be WAAAAY down if thats the case.
 ???

-beerjet-
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: GT Jets on March 04, 2010, 11:13:11 AM
Please tell me why my 990 rectangle port heads aren't good on my Arias flat top pistons. Seems to be working for me.

Because with a 118 cc combustion chamber and flat tops, even at .010" below deck you will have an approximate CR of 8.0:1   :thumbdown:

This number will drop a bit with eyebrow valve reliefs.  ;)

Need some 96cc or 98 cc heads   :thumbup:

What do I win    ;D

GT
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: Luckie Stiff on March 04, 2010, 01:15:40 PM
Ok, ok, this was a test, GT and Omar both passed with flying colors.

More to the point, it was a way to get an explanation of why not to do it, rather than just saying it's not good. This is how people learn from us.
Carry on
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: enginedoctor on March 04, 2010, 01:47:13 PM
Flat top/2 relief @ 4.310 bore w/ 100 cc heads over  9:1  :thumbup:
-----based on .010 in hole  w/ .039 gasket---- :sly:
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: GT Jets on March 04, 2010, 04:01:29 PM
Ok, ok, this was a test, GT and Omar both passed with flying colors.

More to the point, it was a way to get an explanation of why not to do it, rather than just saying it's not good. This is how people learn from us.
Carry on

I would have written an IRREBEL novel, but I was working on a building management EMS system when I posted that and did not have time, then simply forgot about it..

Thank you teacher  :screwy:   You could have just answered why.. ;D

IMHO 9-10:1 is the window of desire as far as CR, 9.5:1 is very pump gas friendly and makes plenty of grunt...

GT
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: enginedoctor on March 04, 2010, 04:53:12 PM
Hmmm. .... Skip's  7.5 : 1  BBC would make a great generator for my shop compressors . hahaha  :D
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: Luckie Stiff on March 04, 2010, 05:06:41 PM
Hmmm. .... Skip's  7.5 : 1  BBC would make a great generator for my shop compressors . hahaha  :D

7.5:1 ? Holy balls! I gots to git me sum rasin gas now, hi compreshun moter an all
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: enginedoctor on March 04, 2010, 05:09:33 PM
7.5:1 ? Holy balls! I gots to git me sum rasin gas now, hi compreshun moter an all

LuvYa Skip  :-*
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: OC2Vegas on March 04, 2010, 06:05:01 PM
Hmmm. .... Skip's  7.5 : 1  BBC would make a great generator for my shop compressors . hahaha  :D

Sounds about right to throw and 8-71 on it  :thumbup:
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: enginedoctor on March 04, 2010, 06:09:03 PM
 X 2...So long as it's not cast crap :thumbdown:
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: Ralph Brunt on March 04, 2010, 07:34:32 PM
i saw it was a chebby thread so i ignored it at first, then curiosity got the better of me :-[ and i still dont know what the fork you guys are talking about ???

but i did understand oil pan :thumbup: so here is my .02
http://www.aroilpans.com/ (http://www.aroilpans.com/)
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: 76NORDIC on March 04, 2010, 08:12:29 PM
Ralph ya know the ole saying that curiosity killed the cat right ??? well drill these suckers and learn  sumpthin, even tho it is a lowly chebbie   LOL >:D >:D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: jet boat performance on March 05, 2010, 02:47:00 PM
Superduty ,the information hopefully below maybe helpfull to your
understanding. The "cut" references eg "AA", "A" "B" etc  refer to the
the size/cut/angle of the exit side of the Impeller respective to the
exit side large and small diameters . That "cut" determines/controls
how and what water is "moved"  of course depending on the actual
horsepower applied and absorbed. We reserve Smaller (alphabetically)
Impellers  (b's and c's)  for Smaller displacement engines as well
engines built to make power at higher rpms . Engines that make Big
Grunt power/torque at lower rpms can swing a large Impeller such as a
9.5 inch or AA and move the same  water without turning the rpms

re the headers if they are in decent condtion theres place in the
Valley and in AZ that will "hpc coat" them for around $200,lines run $150
rechrome is a different subject and not worth it IMO , a new set of
Chrome water injected headers runs $895 complete Good Luck Tom




(https://www.socaljetboats.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi147.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fr319%2Fjetboatperformance%2Fimpeller_chart_sd3091.gif&hash=b0d7771075ec4bdeca864f2f8e0427cb9a55eca7)

IMPELLER SPECIFICATIONS
IMPELLER SIZE LARGE DIAMETER SMALL DIAMETER MACHINED ANGLE

9 1/2" 9-1/2" 8-1/4" 25 DEGREES
9 1/4" 9-1/4" 8-1/4" 20 DEGREES
AA 9-3/32" 7-13/16" 25 DEGREES
A 9" 7-1/4" 30 DEGREES
B 8-3/4" 6-3/4" 33-1/2 DEGREES
C 8-1/2" 6-1/2" 33-1/2 DEGREES

H.P. 9.5 9.25 AA A B C
150 2900 3050 3200 3600 3800 4050
200 3200 3350 3500 4000 4200 4450
250 3450 3600 3700 4300 4500 4800
300 3800 3950 4050 4550 4800 5100
350 4050 4200 4300 4750 5100 5350
400 4250 4400 4500 5050 5300 5600
450 4450 4600 4700 5250 5500 5850
500 4650 4800 4950 5400 5700 6050
550 4800 4950 5100 5550 5850 N/A
*THESE RPM VALUES MAY VARY ACCORDING TO HOW YOUR BOAT ALLOWS THE PUMP TO LOAD
HORSE POWER REQUIREMENTS ARE AT THE PUMP SHAFT
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: Marcsrollin on March 05, 2010, 06:15:23 PM
Here is another chart for for cut vs. horse power.
[attachimg=#]
Title: Re: Few Jet Questions.
Post by: 78_Tahiti on March 05, 2010, 11:11:12 PM
Thanks guys those charts are great!
SMFPacks CMS 1.0.3 © 2026