SoCal Jet Boats
Tech Talk => Jet Pumps => Topic started by: IRRebel on February 18, 2009, 05:04:34 AM
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OK, where do you get an adjustable pressure valve for between the jet and engine, first off, and how much pressure should it be set at? This weekend should get the Moo running, HP 460 with Rewarder headers, still unsure about running a thermostat or not, but HELP! before I make a milkshake out of THIS engine too!
Ray
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Ray the Thermostat kits are not actually available for fords as such , we make/mill "one off" adaptors to use the Chevy/Olds kits on them . re the pressures you might be surprized contrary to what you hear the pressures if set up corectly are around 15 psi The pressure relief valve adust from a little below that to around 80 . attached is a simple header plumbing , I'll be around to help if you need it just call the shop or PM Tom
t-stat kit is $85 ,complete pressure kit with OB dump and T and valve under $100
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Here's what is on the boat, as far as a water outlet. haven't removed it to see if they ran a t-stat or not yet.
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bad pic, but looks almost like a normal water outler with 3 small hose barbs on it.
Here's the front cover from it
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Kinda strange too.
here's what the Yellow Submarine (Saguaro) had on it.
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And no, Tom, the boat has no overboard dump on it, gonna need you to put together a care package for me Pronto! PM me with the cost, gotta do it!
Ray
(Hopefully Photobucket works for pics, we all KNOW how much I've fought this battle!)
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YAY! I figured it out GT!!! tee hee, see, even a moron can do this........no to resize them................hmmmm
ray
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Oh and here's what's going in.
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Dam big pics! That didn't work, oh well, I'll get it!
Anyway, '71 block, Ported police interceptor heads, Comp 292 extreme solid lifter cam, Roller rockers, screw it studs w/guideplates, TRW 2443 forged pistons, H-beam rods, Eddie Performer RPM intake and 750 Carb (will be replaced by Offy Tunnel and 2 750's if all works out ok for now, didn't want to sink EVERYTHING in 1 shot)
Ray
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I believe you are wanting something like a Watts 5300C adjustable by-pass relief valve. You should be able to find this as a plumbing supply store.
I have mine set at 15 psi. Anything above that is dumped thru the relief line plumbed to a thru hull water dump.
Hope this helped answer your question.
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pressure kit with OB dump under $100
here you go , straight from Tom @ JBP ;D
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Ray the Thermostat kits are not actually available for fords as such , we make/mill "one off" adaptors to use the Chevy/Olds kits on them . re the pressures you might be surprized contrary to what you hear the pressures if set up corectly are around 15 psi The pressure relief valve adust from a little below that to around 80 . attached is a simple header plumbing , I'll be around to help if you need it just call the shop or PM Tom
t-stat kit is $85 ,complete pressure kit with OB dump and T and valve under $100
(https://www.socaljetboats.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi147.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fr319%2Fjetboatperformance%2Fdiagramjet11.jpg&hash=16e32c6c98d14f06878e6ca67c0852d7c89a76f9)
The drawing makes sense above, my only question is where does the pressure relief valve go in the pic? I'm looking to setup the same kind of deal on my boat.. Right now it doesn't have a relief valve or a t-stat, temp is controlled by turning down the gate valve which I really want to get away from and save my motor.. Thanks..
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Nevermind, I see it @ the bottom left.. ;D
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here you go , straight from Tom @ JBP ;D
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Thanks Steve ;) !
re the pressure relief it goes on the "water out" from the jet and back overboard before the water goes to the front of the motor Tom
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Another method to insure you don't get too much pressure in the block is simply to run 2 dump lines from your block (if you're running O/T or any other injected headers) Almost every manifold has places on it to take H2O from, find one and use that for your header water, take BOTH of the outlets from the Tstat housing overboard, you should never see more than 18-20 PSI in your block this way, and that's right where you want it.
Oh yeah, it won't cost you a C note either!
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Ok, thought I had a headache just getting home from work, now I REALLY got one, :banghead: where's my beer? oh yeah, ok. I think I get it. No thermostat in the thermostat housing, right? stick with the dealio that's on the engine with three outlets on it, that way I dun need to take pipe plugs out of the Intake. Or use the flat one with 2 on it and remove a pipe plug so I can run AN fittings later. Run two straight to an over board dump (For which I will need to drill and install some sort of fitting). Then as insurance, run a Watts pressure releif valve after the gate or ball valve from the pump, to a second overboard dump, for which I need to drill yet another hole and install another of the same sort of fitting. Unless I put in 1 big some sort of fitting for all three hoses running out the back of the boat on it. then somewhere in the mess, probably between the gate valve and the releif valve put in a hose fitting for running off a hose. :sly:
Do I have this yet :screwy:
Now to complicate things worse, ( I'm good at complications :banghead:), a water cooled oil cooler plumbed in before the remote oil filters. I am going to assume I want to t off the incoming lake water, run one line directly into the one of the block fittings and the other through the cooler then into the other block fitting? Just a guess, but sounds reasonable. Or run one of the dump lines from the t-stat housing through the cooler? :screwy:
Guys, this is actually starting to make sense in my lil brain, Tom, you able to get a parts list out of all that? lol
THANKS,
Ray
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Hey Tom, what's that fitting and clear tube tapped into the side of that pump in the pic for? Never saw anything like that. :sly:
Ray
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Oh, and.......sounds like, what was her name? (Oh, and there was this time at band camp..................), anyway. The Rewarders are what I plan to run, but no T valve for them. Can I just use an AN T fitting, or do they require a valve like my Bassett T Valve? Don't know what the valve part of it is supposed to do, but if necessary I'll use it and I can pick up another Bassett valve for the bassetts later.
Thanks again,
Ray
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Ray I have a good used t valve ,call my cell (check pms) I 'll walk you thru the plumbing deal Happy to help Tom
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Thanks Tom, Calling cell..........1 ringy dingy, 2 ringy dingy...............
Looky what Santa brought me early! I guess he wants to make sure I don't break this new engine!
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Ray
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Whata a "clause" !! maybe it was Fred? anyhow I got you a perfect SWTG Bassset T on my desk when your ready Tom
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Hey Tom, what's that fitting and clear tube tapped into the side of that pump in the pic for? Never saw anything like that. :sly:
Ray
pump primer?
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Lol, I dunno, Tom kinda bypassed that one, would make sense for running off a hose, or maybe a flow meter of some sort?
Maybe a new thread, "Whatsit?????"
Ray
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Lol, I dunno, Tom kinda bypassed that one, would make sense for running off a hose, or maybe a flow meter of some sort?
Maybe a new thread, "Whatsit?????"
Ray
It's a compression fitting. Oh wait you mean what does it do? I believe it is an intake pressure tap. to see what kind of intake pressure you are getting.
looking at that I wonder if i can tap my WJ with a 1/2 water hose bib so i can run it on the trailer. Then just stick a pipe plug in there when I am out on the lake.
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Do you guys that run a thermostat w/ a relief valve also run a water strainer of any sort? What if a twig or something of the sort gets pumped into the line from the jet. It seems like it something like that could plug up the thermostat and possibly restrict all water flow?? I want thinking of adding a relief/thermostat kit to my jet, but after that was mentioned to me, it seems like it could be legit issue?
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I don't run a thermostat at all! I control my water temp with a hose bib right after the pump then with a hose to the Inlet. My dump also runs through a hose bib so I can control the water in and out. But i usually keep the out Wide OPEN!
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No thermostat. 'tis what I'm told, makes sense. Control temperature and pressure through the releif valve and valve controlling engine flow.
Sure a stick or twig COULD give you an issue, but you would notice it in the temp and pressure readings if it stuck there. Hence the need. I think that is the exception, though, and not the rule. I'm sure it's a very rare occurance that anything that small would remain stuck there for very long. Even at 15 PSI, stick your face in an air hose at 15 and see how long you stay in place.
Ray
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Does anyone know exactly how much water pressure actually comes out of the jet to feed the water line to the motor?
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Thanks Tom, Calling cell..........1 ringy dingy, 2 ringy dingy...............
Looky what Santa brought me early! I guess he wants to make sure I don't break this new engine!
(https://www.socaljetboats.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi673.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fvv95%2FIrrebel%2FP2180038.jpg&hash=a44b2b8fd7e1bf5b58ac24a8da552b15749c5b4e)
Ray
WHATS THE GOLF CLUB FOR ???
;D
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Funny, my son said the same thing!. It went into the gold bread pan, then goes on the bottom of the blue thingy like this.
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Ray
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Does anyone know exactly how much water pressure actually comes out of the jet to feed the water line to the motor?
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I've been told, or read, or maybe dreamed, somewhere in the neighborhood of 300 PSI at speed?
Someone will chime in if I'm off my meds again...............
Ray
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Not nearly as much as you might think , 15 to maybe 30 under some conditions, honestly folks these boats if you think about it were originally produced in the 70s with no valveing , no gate or ball valves at the jet water take off, no thermostat kits (excepting Berk Pakajets) with largley automotive type engines ,"marinized" with a set of exaust manifolds and a flame arrestor. no voodoo no high tech stuff! My first new Jet in late 75 had a simple single unregulated line to a T to the front of the motor then out of the top of the intake to the exaust thats it (its still running today that way without a hitch ) Tom
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I've been told, or read, or maybe dreamed, somewhere in the neighborhood of 300 PSI at speed?
Someone will chime in if I'm off my meds again...............
Ray
Stop and think for a second! If it were anywhere near 300 , How far would it shoot out of the overboard dump!
Another thing to think about is what side of the impeller is the motor getting its water from? ( hint , The suction side not the pressurized side )
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Not nearly as much as you might think , 15 to maybe 30 under some conditions, honestly folks these boats if you think about it were originally produced in the 70s with no valveing , no gate or ball valves at the jet water take off, no thermostat kits (excepting Berk Pakajets) with largley automotive type engines ,"marinized" with a set of exaust manifolds and a flame arrestor. no voodoo no high tech stuff! My first new Jet in late 75 had a simple single unregulated line to a T to the front of the motor then out of the top of the intake to the exaust thats it (its still running today that way without a hitch ) Tom
Wow that really makes you think, good info as always Tom..........
Now another question, what is the most pressure you can have before you lose a gasket and milkshake the bitch.
My pressure relief valve only puts out anywhere between 7-22 lbs to the engine
With the way they had it back in the day compared to now, and with all our new valves and goodies seems people have more problems now then back then... things seemed to be simplified then i guess.......
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Not nearly as much as you might think , 15 to maybe 30 under some conditions, honestly folks these boats if you think about it were originally produced in the 70s with no valving , no gate or ball valves at the jet water take off, no thermostat kits (excepting Berk Pakajets) with largely automotive type engines ,"marinized" with a set of exhaust manifolds and a flame arrestor. no voodoo no high tech stuff! My first new Jet in late 75 had a simple single unregulated line to a T to the front of the motor then out of the top of the intake to the exhaust that's it (its still running today that way without a hitch ) Tom
well the thermostat and PR valve mods would still seem to benefit performance and reliability...right?
p-jet
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Does anyone know exactly how much water pressure actually comes out of the jet to feed the water line to the motor?
The most I have ever seen is 40# on a BBC spinning 6.5K in a river runner, it had a bit too much shoe and was loading like crazy, it actually blew a Freeze plug out of the side of the block and almost sank the boat.. ::)
GT
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Wow that really makes you think, good info as always Tom..........
Now another question, what is the most pressure you can have before you lose a gasket and milkshake the bitch.
My pressure relief valve only puts out anywhere between 7-22 lbs to the engine
With the way they had it back in the day compared to now, and with all our new valves and goodies seems people have more problems now then back then... things seemed to be simplified then i guess.......
well the thermostat and PR valve mods would still seem to benefit performance and reliability...right?
p-jet
Alls I'm saying is Jet boats are fairly simple uncomplicated "beasts" I belive the majority of things we do are often are possibly corrections for other problems or conditions eg mismatched heads,intakes, poorly sealed intakes and timing covers etc etc , maybe because its our Guy nature to have to phuck with something ;D , example & case in piont: my FILaws 78 Glastron CVX 20 has no less than 1000 hrs on the original motor and Berk jet runs close to 60mph @4800 rpms sounds good has 60 lbs of OP runs 120 * and a OE frt sump pan! still starts every time never has had more than a half dozen of Rhondas siblings and us and kids and grandkids driving the sh*t out of it for years , nothing but oil changes a couple starters and a carb o'haul or two , no water valves no t -stat , No bs one of my Bro in laws used to spin donuts in this thing over and over again , its been beat abused almost sunk and overheated and to top it off when her "Pops" changes the oil on the Glastron he pulls the oil sender and puts in a fitting and a pipe to a 5 gal bucket and fires the motor to pump the oil out ??? (I know I cringe) Tom
BTW re "suction Pressure" (sounds like an oximoron huh) when actually you "guage" these boats you'll be amazed your suction will go to around 10 to 15 on average , maybe higher if you have aggressive hardware such as Glenn described and the faster you go and the more HP you add and the more aggresssive you get etc etc , Tim Place told me "Going places" (fuel boat) would "Data" 150 psi at half track ;)
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I think I'm just going to leave mine as is and not make it more complicated.. no thermostat & no regulator.. I've been running it that way since I got it (2yrs) because that's how it was setup originally, i didn't know better :). If the regular is 15psi and max is 30psi, i don't think i should have any problems (knock on wood!).. I've turned the gate valve down to run at as hot has I can (runs a touch over 140 @ WOT), that's as hot as I can get without smoking the motor at idle..
I know a the t-stat and regulator would help, keeping the temp at a constant 160 which is ideal.. but, i wouldn't feel comfortable with a t-stat and reg without a water strainer in-front of them.. i know i would be the guy that sucked up some tiny twig the cut the flow in the t-stat and burned my motor.. i dont think I have the room for it in my tiny hull..
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Stop and think for a second! If it were anywhere near 300 , How far would it shoot out of the overboard dump!
Another thing to think about is what side of the impeller is the motor getting its water from? ( hint , The suction side not the pressurized side )
Take another look at a Berk suction housing Marc...you'll see that the entrance to the engine water outlet on the suction housing is actually BEHIND the wear ring and off to the side of it, which would be the pressure side of the impeller. After all, something has to push that water through the motor...it's not gonna flow through it all on its own.