SoCal Jet Boats
Discussion => The No Wake Zone => Topic started by: OnceUponaThyme on September 03, 2012, 09:36:47 AM
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Hi there :) new to the forum, as well as jet boats (and boats in general!) And even though I've wandered the forums for a few hours now thinking it would help my comprehension I'm thinking I just succeeded in making myself more confused than before!
We recently bought an Avenger jet boat with a 454 BBC, has some scary looking OT headers and nearly blows my eardrums when we take it out on the lake (only been to Castaic so far, since its around the corner from us...) We definitely fell into this whole thing blind, and luckily got some insight from a friend of a friends, but i mainly have been trying to figure out the logistics of changing out the headers for something a bit more... Kid friendly? (don't hate me!) And while i see mentions of TT headers and logs and snails, i just can't quite grasp everything just yet... What needs water, what doesn't? What parts are needed to change to something thru the hull instead of out the top - that kind of thing...
If anyone knows where a "jet boats for dummies" area is, could they possibly point me there? I'd be forever grateful :)
(edited to correct what autocorrect screwed up...)
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Welcome to SCJB ;D
SoCalJetBoats is as close to Jet Boats for Dummies you will find. Everyone here is very helpful and willing to pass on information (unlike some of the other sites out there).
Post some pics of what you have and we'll try to point you in the right direction for your needs.
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Its good to be here! A little frustrating with sooo much new information and my brain struggling to keep up :screwy:
Here's try #2 at the pics... My phone likes to take huge pictures so had to figure this out... Im not sure what pics would be helpful so i only took a couple, if there's something else i should show just say the word :)
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Welcome :beer:
All exhaust systems need water for cooling or they give off crazy heat, I know some guys will run dry sometimes I think for extra HP.
By the looks of you transom you would need to punch a couple of holes for TT headers or logs w/snails. Placement of holes is important which im not sure about. You can run logs and OT pipes if you're hesitant about putting holes. Logs w/OT pipes will cut down on noise a little.
Hopes this helps.
Btw where are you located I'm in Ventura?
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Being that the transom has never been cut for exhaust, I personally would not want to cut it.
If you got a good deal on the boat and are not emotionally attached to it, you should be able to sell it or trade it for something more family freindly.
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Logs and snails will for sure quiet it down and be more kid friendly
I've seen lots of sets on Craigslist and some even have the hose and exhaust tips.
I'm not sure of the hose routing but I'm sure it's pretty easy once you put the logs on
To figure out the cooling hose routing.
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I don't see any baffles in there. They help somewhat
Fat fingered from the phone- Corey
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I live close to Castaic as well and am surprised you got on there without baffles. I wouldn't recommend anything other than a good pair of baffles. Easy to install. Somebody here has to have a set they don't use anymore. Rex Marine has a Bassett pair for $290 or Rex design for $140. I think you would like the result from the Rex design and you won't have to Break Out Another Thousand. If you try and replace exhaust even with all used parts you will spend alot.
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Fantasy - the water lines we have now have caused a couple issues - there is a manual adjustment near the drivers seat that we weren't told about and already had to flush the engine because it was apparently wide open and flooding the valves... Got that figured out, but ideally would like something where that wouldn't be a concern - the idea of going thru the transom is more a safety thing in my mind than noise with the kids (I'm officially inducted into the "burned my leg on the headers "club) and while we don't let the kids near them its still a concern... Ideally, I'd like a setup where we could put some type of cover over the back to make getting in and out easier.
We are in Castaic, just around the corner from it, really... Been here almost three years without any water toys and probably got in over our heads with the boat, but the PWC area here is just sad...
Crewchief - still paying for it, so can't trade it out just yet, though its already been decided this is just a first step in our boating adventure...
Corey and bubbledeck- JUST had the sheriff checking for baffles on our last outing on Saturday (even though we had been there at least 8 times before and no one looked...) And apparently they ARE in there somewhere??
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First off, welcome to SCJB. From the looks of it, you are in Stonegate. You have a set of Bassett twisty headers, I am also surprised that the NFL (no fun lake) let you on the water with no baffles. As said above, all exhaust requires water in a pleasure boat. And swapping from headers to logs or even through transom headers is super easy( much easier than the reverse). If you do change the system, you should have no problem unloading the OT's to help offset the cost of the conversion.
SJ
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Thanks SuperJet - and you got it.. We are in Stonegate :) but now I'm all confused about the baffles because, as i said, the sheriff said they are there :sly: I stuck my arm up the pipe (after it had been sitting for a while of course ;) ) and could feel to the 4 pipe separation, so started wondering if there could be separate baffles inside those? But because the kids are always using the flashlights for absolutely no good reason, I couldn't see in like he did. :banghead:
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Thanks SuperJet - and you got it.. We are in Stonegate :) but now I'm all confused about the baffles because, as i said, the sheriff said they are there :sly: I stuck my arm up the pipe (after it had been sitting for a while of course ;) ) and could feel to the 4 pipe separation, so started wondering if there could be separate baffles inside those? But because the kids are always using the flashlights for absolutely no good reason, I couldn't see in like he did. :banghead:
I you got to the collector without obstructions there are NO baffles. The sheriffs up here are not the brightest. Te refused to take a report when a guy drove over my trailer with my buddy in the truck. And when my buddy ran his name(he's a Chp) he came up suspended license, and a $150,000 warrant. The sheriff still did nothing.
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its really tough when u already feel over your head about buying a new toy and are already wanting to modify it but relax, from the looks of it you have a nice boat. if it runs good and got u on and off ur trailer with out a paddle or being towed your already ahead of the game. u may want to put thos headers in the classifieds section for a straight out trade for everything, im sure there is some one here with through hull that would like to go over transom, if u asked me 6 months ago i know i would have been willing to give u everything for a set of those. as far as installing them there are many diagrams out there that will show you how the water flows through and u really only need a hole saw a drill and some rtv, i will not let my friends kids ride in my boat any more as it seems they are drawn to chrome and headers like flys to fire. another thing is that if u do go through transom exhaust u will be able to run enough water and keep them cool enough to make an engine cover, but we will get into that later
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I am coming to the party a little late here, but.....Welcome to the fun.
That looks like a really nice little boat you have there.
One of the great things about jet boats is the "kid friendliness". That being said, the opposite of that is when over transom headers are installed.
They are hot as Hades, loud, limit what lakes you can use the boat on and simply obnoxious.
WOW, I sounded like my dad there for a minute.. ::)
If you like the boat but the noise/heat are too much for you then I would recommend installing logs and snails. They are many times quieter than headers, you can literally set your hand on the log when your engine is running without burning yourself and adds valuable storage space to the boat.
The cons are pretty straight forward, they rob a bit of horsepower (I would say 5-10% is fair), you need to cut large holes in the transom like crewchief22 says and you don't have them laying around in your garage..
But for you would make the boat way more "enjoyable"
If you are seriously considering swapping out the headers for logs, I have a beautiful set of polished Hardin logs and snails with the outlets and new flappers I can make you one hell of a deal on.
Hit me with a PM and maybe we can work something out.
Forgive me if I missed something in previous posts, I'll be honest, I did not read all of the entries, sort of skimmed through it, I normally read every word before posting, but just taking a quick lunch break on some projects and saw this.... :sly:
GT
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logs suck.
center rise or go home. you'll have to cut holes in the transom anyways, might as well do it right. it doesnt exactly break the bank and you get the positives out of both setups.
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Logs and snails will support well over 500 hp, and is an economical choice. Center rise wont be any benefit HP wise, and are a lil more difficult fo find for a BBF. And logs dont weigh a ton either. Ive been looking for logs for my sbc, and all I can find is McMerc and copies, all iron, they dont look right on an old school jet boat.
just my $.02
Daniel
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hey (mash on it) edelbrock has a set of logs and so does glenwood for you sbc, just so you know. and they are aluminum. just maybe a bit hard to find.
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they are out there every now and again, hardin or harmon has some, and glenwood has 'em new $$$$
Daniel
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Logs and snails will support well over 500 hp, and is an economical choice. Center rise wont be any benefit HP wise, and are a lil more difficult fo find for a BBF. And logs dont weigh a ton either. Ive been looking for logs for my sbc, and all I can find is McMerc and copies, all iron, they dont look right on an old school jet boat.
just my $.02
Daniel
How tall are your valve covers? I have a cool set of manifolds for a small block, but they wont clear really tall valve covers.
And according to the OP he has a BBC, not a BBF ;)
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stock height now, center bolt, but needs taller ones for valvetrain upgrades, Going 58cc aluminum, and rollers and girdles, more cam, and refresh this winter. send some pics :thumbup: I have some decent 'cal custom'? finned ones I'd like to run...
Daniel
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stock height now, center bolt, but needs taller ones for valvetrain upgrades, Going 58cc aluminum, and rollers and girdles, more cam, and refresh this winter. send some pics :thumbup: I have some decent 'cal custom'? finned ones I'd like to run...
Daniel
Sorry for the jack...But I will get some pictures of the ones I have here, I know they did not fit our LT1 with tall square valve covers.....
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its really tough when u already feel over your head about buying a new toy and are already wanting to modify it but relax, from the looks of it you have a nice boat. if it runs good and got u on and off ur trailer with out a paddle or being towed your already ahead of the game. u may want to put thos headers in the classifieds section for a straight out trade for everything, im sure there is some one here with through hull that would like to go over transom, if u asked me 6 months ago i know i would have been willing to give u everything for a set of those. as far as installing them there are many diagrams out there that will show you how the water flows through and u really only need a hole saw a drill and some rtv, i will not let my friends kids ride in my boat any more as it seems they are drawn to chrome and headers like flys to fire. another thing is that if u do go through transom exhaust u will be able to run enough water and keep them cool enough to make an engine cover, but we will get into that later
At least 2 out of 3 times we make it back into the dock without much of an issue, but that being said, the other 1/3 of the time can easily be chalked up to operator error (or simply being so new we hadn't yet found what to expect!) Not exactly in a rush, but figured it'd be best to see if the conversion could be done during the months that its NOT nice enough to go to the lake so we aren't missing out on the fun and seeing as it took me two months to get to the point that i even knew the difference between OT and TT and such i thought i should start researching now ;)
I am coming to the party a little late here, but.....Welcome to the fun.
That looks like a really nice little boat you have there.
One of the great things about jet boats is the "kid friendliness". That being said, the opposite of that is when over transom headers are installed.
They are hot as Hades, loud, limit what lakes you can use the boat on and simply obnoxious.
WOW, I sounded like my dad there for a minute.. ::)
If you like the boat but the noise/heat are too much for you then I would recommend installing logs and snails. They are many times quieter than headers, you can literally set your hand on the log when your engine is running without burning yourself and adds valuable storage space to the boat.
The cons are pretty straight forward, they rob a bit of horsepower (I would say 5-10% is fair), you need to cut large holes in the transom like crewchief22 says and you don't have them laying around in your garage..
But for you would make the boat way more "enjoyable"
If you are seriously considering swapping out the headers for logs, I have a beautiful set of polished Hardin logs and snails with the outlets and new flappers I can make you one hell of a deal on.
Hit me with a PM and maybe we can work something out.
Forgive me if I missed something in previous posts, I'll be honest, I did not read all of the entries, sort of skimmed through it, I normally read every word before posting, but just taking a quick lunch break on some projects and saw this.... :sly:
GT
Thanks for the input! The pros and cons are probably what's most helpful in trying to figure this all out... Definitely interested in doing something to ease my fears of the kids on the boat, but with this all being so new I can't say just when we would be able to do it yet (gotta figure out the main "con" on the equation which would probably be cost at this point! - After buying the boat was told a little saying that seems to be more true every outing "A boat is a hole in the water you throw money into" - but damn... Those times it's all working right, it's just worth it lol)
logs suck.
center rise or go home. you'll have to cut holes in the transom anyways, might as well do it right. it doesnt exactly break the bank and you get the positives out of both setups.
See, now i know what center rise looks like, but that's about it... Do the pipes get as hot as the OT pipes? Could they go under a cover of some sort? They look like they would help in increasing the storage/usability of the stern, but do they really? (Forgive my ignorance, please, there was nowhere near as much info on center rise pipes when I was looking up the options before - although it's quite possible that i just missed it not knowing what to look for...)
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ooo center rise are niiiiiice! but some serious coin.. http://www.cpperformance.com/c-9-exhaust-systems.aspx (http://www.cpperformance.com/c-9-exhaust-systems.aspx) if u look at the gm replacements thos are ur best bet as far as price.. with gas prices on the rise i had to start recycling beer cans for weekend money