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eliminator18

  • Karma: +2/-0
454 build help
« on: April 15, 2012, 04:30:55 PM »
I have a stock 454 with a 600 cfm carb, I want to achieve 600-700hp all motor, what do you guys recommend I do to achieve this goal? What type of heads, cams, carbs would I need to make this happen? I would also like to be able to achieve a 5k-6k rpm of possiable ? Thanks
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crewchief22

  • Karma: +66/-0
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #1 on: April 15, 2012, 07:08:48 PM »
You need to do some serious research before you start a build of that caliber.  It's not too difficult to build one in the 500-550 range but to push past 600hp that will live in a jet boat will take some expensive, quality parts.

The easiest way to make that kind of power would be to put a blower or a couple turbos on it.   :thumbup:

The best way to do it without boost would be to go big cubic inches, add a stroker crank, good steel rods, and 12.1/+ compression, big roller cam.  Cylinder heads will need professional help for either cast iron or aluminum.

The problem isn't even getting the base engine built but all the accessory items that will be needed to go with it (intake, carbs, fuel pump, ignition system) along with the "work" required to the pump and hull to utilze the power.

Good luck with the build  ;D
  • Boat #1: '77 Hondo Pantera GT Jet
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"Racing is life!  Anything that happens before or after, is just waiting"    Steve McQueen

The problem with America is stupidity. I'm not saying there should be a capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?

berkbryan

  • Karma: +3/-0
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #2 on: April 15, 2012, 07:19:34 PM »
if it was me I would wait till next winter to start a project like that summer is here and short
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mobboss

  • Karma: +15/-0
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #3 on: April 15, 2012, 07:39:18 PM »
the big prob with high horse power motors is not getting to hit those numbers its getting it to stay together!  your going to need to sit down and put it out on paper and do your home work. all the way.   i would start with talking to machine shops see what they are charging . cause your motor parts will be there a while.
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obnoxious001

  • Karma: +4/-1
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #4 on: April 15, 2012, 08:27:10 PM »
I have a stock 454 with a 600 cfm carb, I want to achieve 600-700hp all motor, what do you guys recommend I do to achieve this goal? What type of heads, cams, carbs would I need to make this happen? I would also like to be able to achieve a 5k-6k rpm of possiable ? Thanks

There is a bunch of difference between 600 and 700 HP.  You haven't mentioned budget, that's an important part of the equation.  What parts do you already have.. lots of versions of "stock 454"

Here's one I put together that started out to be shooting for 500 HP, couple of changes along the way and was able to produce over 600 HP on pump gas.  http://www.riverdavesplace.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29409
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eliminator18

  • Karma: +2/-0
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #5 on: April 15, 2012, 09:16:38 PM »
The block number comes up as 14015445, and from what I have found its from a truck, so that explains the low end torq, looks like I'm going to have to change the heads to flow more air, and change the cam and up grade to a 750 or 800 cfm carb, and even maybe consider a stroker kit, looks like I'm going to be spending some coin on this bitch!! :screwy:

Would swapping the cam and installing a roller rocker set up make a big difference?
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mobboss

  • Karma: +15/-0
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #6 on: April 15, 2012, 09:28:06 PM »
it will only if you have the other key parts. see anyone can slap an engine together but  not everyone can build an engine.theres alot that goes into an engine to make it purr .
  • Boat #1: boat less
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eliminator18

  • Karma: +2/-0
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #7 on: April 15, 2012, 09:37:55 PM »
If I'm going to do this I'm going to do it right!! I'm going to have an engine builder tear the whole engine apart and start from the ground up, and then I will have it engine dyno'd / tuned, I also want it some what reliable, and not a ticking time bomb
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GT Jets

  • Karma: +192/-0
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #8 on: April 15, 2012, 10:29:10 PM »
Stupid question number one.. ::)


How did you come up with wanting a 600 HP 454?  ???

A properly dialed in 450 HP in a light low profile jet with some minor pump work (and potentially some bottom modifications) will put you in the low 70's and should be able to do it for hours at a time and you wont have to buy fuel at the airport... ;)

GT
  • Boat #1: 1992 Carrera 20.5 Elite (I/O bitches)
  • Boat #2: 19' Bubble deck Jet BBC Berkeley
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If i get some free time tonight at work, ill play with it and post it for everyone to see.

Time to man up and yank it John!  :banghead:
Ray

fastmarlene

  • Karma: +1/-0
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #9 on: April 16, 2012, 05:20:08 PM »
It looks like you already have found the casitng numbers on the block.  Next step would be to find the casting numbers on your heads.  That will help you to determine if they are usable on your new build.  IF you are convinced you want to do something this summer, you could improve the carburetor, intake, and exhaust.  Those would be some pretty simple things you could do yourself and not have to pay a shop.  Might wake up your motor a little and if the performance change is not enough you can still use the parts on your next engine.
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surfaholic

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #10 on: May 15, 2012, 03:00:29 PM »
i have the gen v 454 that i finished a year ago.. now i KNOW there is gona be some hate on this comment but it worked great for me, i used probe pistons dome top +18cc that alone brings your comression up to a respectable amount in the 9s $400.. here comes the hate, i used pro comp alluminum heads from skip white, he uses the pro comp castings cleans them up and uses good valves and springs i checked the tollerances with a mic and everything looked suprizingly good! it was even port matched to the gaskets, 1000 bux with the stud kit and rocker studs, u need to use rocker studs so u can adjust the valve lash, plus the penut port heads use and smaller size shoulder bolt.. u will also need to use the longer push rods and guides, i just cut and welded mine. i also run the oval port procomp intake since it had the correct water inlets over the edelbrock penut port intake, i run the lunati bracket master cam, the biggest one they have it likes to idle around 800rpm (VERRY CHOPPY) and  REALY wakes up at 25rpm pulles like a raped ape through 6500, toped with a 800cfm holly and i am very happy with my motor it has run great for me every time and been in multiple vehicles, one car one truck and one other boat ( i helped my friends test their chassis they built).. even tho pro comp has such a bad rep it was in my price range.. super chevy did a build of our motor and acheaved 700 horses i believe with a shot of nitrous.. my penut port heads were a p.o.s so getting work on them was out of the question but if u wanted to u could have a shop give u a comp valve job and bowl work, along with 18cc dome pistons, that should bring your cr into the 9s.. its hard for mild cams and penut port heads to build hp but this isnt a street car so run a bigger cam it will help alot. oooor find a set of oval port older heads have them worked on keep the low compression which will be great for a forced induction set up, so its really up to u, if u want to chance a ill reputable company as i did u miiight get lucky i sure know i did, i dont know what my horse power is ill have to uses the berk-o-dyno when i feel safe enough with my new to me hull, but it is WAY more hp than it was on the cheap and seems to be enough.. for now :p                                                                                                                 ps, check out the 700 hp 454 budget build on super chevy      and if any one wants to take my old penut port heads id be happy to give them to u if ur close to redondo beach
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raginaquaholic

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #11 on: May 15, 2012, 03:36:13 PM »
Doesn't get any easier than that. Very informative.
« Last Edit: May 15, 2012, 03:38:40 PM by raginaquaholic »
  • Boat #1: 1979 Nordic Day Cruiser
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Riverguy553

  • Karma: +1/-0
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #12 on: May 15, 2012, 06:29:40 PM »
Just built a gen IV 454 and got 617 HP. Went 30 over. We put CP pistons, isky cam, isky lifters, and I had Doctor J'S performance do up a set of bare pro comp aluminum heads with all of his parts he puts in. Put a new edlebrock performer manifold on her with a holly 750. I have the dyno sheets that I can scan and show people. I recommend putting your motor on a dyno to dial it in, was the best money I spent.
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Beaveretriever

  • Karma: +34/-0
454 build help
« Reply #13 on: May 15, 2012, 08:43:15 PM »
Just built a gen IV 454 and got 617 HP. Went 30 over. We put CP pistons, isky cam, isky lifters, and I had Doctor J'S performance do up a set of bare pro comp aluminum heads with all of his parts he puts in. Put a new edlebrock performer manifold on her with a holly 750. I have the dyno sheets that I can scan and show people. I recommend putting your motor on a dyno to dial it in, was the best money I spent.

How much did that cost you? And how much time? Lol
  • Boat #1: 1981 Eliminator Daytona 19' Jet
  • Boat #2: 2003 22' Placecraft Deck boat
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surfaholic

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #14 on: May 15, 2012, 10:31:49 PM »
Finally some one else with pro comp heads,  ;D I wish I had the gen iv block its such a pain to make up the compression lost in the v and there is no gasket confusion with aftermarket heads, quick question do u know if they just had a lower deck height or are the internals like crank and rod lengths different?
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eliminator18

  • Karma: +2/-0
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #15 on: May 16, 2012, 06:01:56 AM »
i need help deciding which engine i should build, i have 2 454's an need to know which one is a better block, cast #14015445, or cast#361959 "P" can someone please help me out, thanks.
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raginaquaholic

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #16 on: May 16, 2012, 08:56:54 AM »
I would build witch ever one is the true 454 four bolt main. I always keep a spare BBC on the stand just in case I trash one. The summer can go by quick.
  • Boat #1: 1979 Nordic Day Cruiser
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surfaholic

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #17 on: May 16, 2012, 10:42:34 AM »
We need the head numbers to, thos numbers could  from 1970 to 1990 car hi perf to a slug truck motor.. Hopefully u have a set of closed chamber heads
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Riverguy553

  • Karma: +1/-0
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #18 on: May 17, 2012, 03:22:48 PM »
How much did that cost you? And how much time? Lol

It's only money buddy. Now that I tried cutting off my 2 fingers so much for finishing it this weekend....  :-[
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GT Jets

  • Karma: +192/-0
Re: 454 build help
« Reply #19 on: May 17, 2012, 03:32:28 PM »
It's only money buddy. Now that I tried cutting off my 2 fingers so much for finishing it this weekend....  :-[


For reals? :(

That sucks, I have that Tee shirt and wish I didn't... :sly:

Speedy recovery bro.

GT
  • Boat #1: 1992 Carrera 20.5 Elite (I/O bitches)
  • Boat #2: 19' Bubble deck Jet BBC Berkeley
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If i get some free time tonight at work, ill play with it and post it for everyone to see.

Time to man up and yank it John!  :banghead:
Ray

 


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