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enginedoctor

  • Karma: +7/-0
Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« on: May 01, 2010, 06:37:18 PM »
IMHO ...Please dont :thumbdown:

Ask me WHY >:D
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Nordie

  • Karma: +13/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #1 on: May 01, 2010, 07:04:44 PM »
I'll be interested to see the do's and and do nots but I'm not asking why
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enginedoctor

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #2 on: May 01, 2010, 07:16:55 PM »
I'll be interested to see the do's and and do nots but I'm not asking why


Nordie....I just told you why...let's see what the others say 8)
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Ralph Brunt

  • Karma: +51/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #3 on: May 01, 2010, 07:22:53 PM »
detonation kills >:D and if you are not the mr good wrench chances are you wont even hear it happening.

ive said it many times before CHEAP AINT GOOD AND GOOD AINT CHEAP.

read my sig line ;D
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CHEAP, FAST, RELIABLE...PICK 2 CANT HAVE ALL 3
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They are all fukin tasty. My long time favorite, "Dirty Dicks -beerjet-
Glasscutter, Skip, OC2  Nordie and many more nail me good every time, relentlessly, I love those guys!

enginedoctor

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #4 on: May 01, 2010, 07:37:05 PM »
Calling on all engine  experts to chime in here....Opinions wanted ;D
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Nordie

  • Karma: +13/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2010, 07:50:52 PM »
in this operation ralph no one is trying to cut corners we'll just leave it at that! just perspective like dave is saying
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76NORDIC

  • Karma: +23/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2010, 08:03:58 PM »
Ya but ya be talking chebbie I am guessing :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:
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The definition of insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again, and expecting different results.....Einstein

I refuse to call people an ass anymore. It insults hard working donkeys worldwide!

enginedoctor

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #7 on: May 01, 2010, 08:07:02 PM »
in this operation ralph no one is trying to cut corners we'll just leave it at that! just perspective like dave is saying



this is not a debate....matter of fact.....lets see what other's say...just curious, ;D
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enginedoctor

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2010, 08:10:23 PM »
Ya but ya be talking chebbie I am guessing :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:


Mr. 76... you are joking right...after everything I have taught  you :sly:
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76NORDIC

  • Karma: +23/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #9 on: May 01, 2010, 08:15:46 PM »

Mr. 76... you are joking right...after everything I have taught  you :sly:

OK shorty don't get your panties in a bunch, I was just fruckin around :screwy:
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The definition of insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again, and expecting different results.....Einstein

I refuse to call people an ass anymore. It insults hard working donkeys worldwide!

enginedoctor

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #10 on: May 01, 2010, 08:19:53 PM »
OK shorty don't get your panties in a bunch, I was just fruckin around :screwy:

You mean my G-string ???
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76NORDIC

  • Karma: +23/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #11 on: May 01, 2010, 08:41:25 PM »
You mean my G-string ???
Oh dude that is disgusting..or shall I say a major party foul :thumbdown: OK back to the thread at hand :thumbup:
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The definition of insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again, and expecting different results.....Einstein

I refuse to call people an ass anymore. It insults hard working donkeys worldwide!

enginedoctor

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #12 on: May 01, 2010, 08:46:41 PM »
Oh dude that is disgusting..or shall I say a major party foul :thumbdown: OK back to the thread at hand :thumbup:


Ya.. but Desiree and Tara never complained.....Back to thread :thumbup:
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GT Jets

  • Karma: +192/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #13 on: May 01, 2010, 08:55:34 PM »
Oh dude that is disgusting..or shall I say a major party foul :thumbdown: OK back to the thread at hand :thumbup:

X2 TMI


Ya.. but Desiree and Tara never complained.....Back to thread :thumbup:

Laughing too hard to comment... ;D


When a Hyper piston (non heat treated) is used in a slight over bored application for marine stuff, accelerated ring land wear and a pretty substantial piston slap can occur due to the rocking of the slug...Coated Hypers could "give up" their silicone or ceramic coatings and contaminate the oil charge with the added skirt wear..They also have an insulating property making them more prone to a cold shock issue (way out on a limb)...

Detonation is another story, a good quality polished dome forged piston can withstand twice the abuse of a Hyper IMHO.....

Hyper pistons have their positives, but really need to be built to OEM specs to really shine. They also seem to really work well with really low cylinder pressures and high cylinder temperatures....

Heat treated T6 Hyper pistons are an excellent middle of the road performance piston, but are close to the same cost of the forgies....

GT
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If i get some free time tonight at work, ill play with it and post it for everyone to see.

Time to man up and yank it John!  :banghead:
Ray

enginedoctor

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #14 on: May 01, 2010, 10:48:57 PM »
GT... on a coated piston skirt ...You cannot get your  piston /to wall...unless you scotch bright the sht off the skirts.
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IRRebel

  • Karma: +16/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #15 on: May 01, 2010, 11:26:29 PM »
I'm by no means an expert when it come to Marine Applications, But I'll chime in because I'm bored.

My experience with street engines showed me how Forged pistons expanded a tad more at temp than cast ones did, being much denser, forcing a slight overhone to compensate and cold piston slap was pretty normal. Didn't have the "Hyper" dealios back in those days, so not even real sure what they even are. My best guess is a form of heat treating and coating a cast piston to simulate true forged pistons and a lesser cost. I just use forged, and will continue to do so regardless of application.

Given our marine applications, save for closed systems, but for our sake, we NEVER see "Normal" operating temperatures, which would throw the normal equations for street use out the window. So I think, maybe, where Dave is headed is on the expansion characteristics of cast aluminum vs. forged aluminum, and how the "Hypers" inadvertently hinder themselves trying to be one but made from another. I have a metalurgical explanation in my lil brain, but it'd take me an hour to explain it.

Ray
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"Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways totally worn out shouting 'Holy Shit what a ride!"---Crewcheif22 AKA Keith

GT Jets

  • Karma: +192/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #16 on: May 01, 2010, 11:30:48 PM »
GT... on a coated piston skirt ...You cannot get your  piston /to wall...unless you scotch bright the sht off the skirts.

I read somewhere that you run Speed Pro coated pistons at a tighter tolerance than stock...wouldn't that mean you could stay tighter in a marine deal?...I have a set of coated Hyper Speed Pros here and they are not round at all (wide at the skirts) they are still in the box and they will stay there..LOL

They measure like an outboard piston (Oblong), does this mean the coating makes the piston bigger on purpose?...

GT
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If i get some free time tonight at work, ill play with it and post it for everyone to see.

Time to man up and yank it John!  :banghead:
Ray

Brad @ SCJB

  • Karma: +255/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #17 on: May 02, 2010, 11:44:43 AM »
here is a good thread about them over on PB.

http://www.performanceboats.com/html/forums/showthread.php?t=17399

the consensus says do not run them in a marine application.
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enginedoctor

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #18 on: May 02, 2010, 02:31:37 PM »
Good info brad :thumbup:

GT..........I can give you at least 3 reasons why you should not use Hyp. Pistons for marine :

1.   Piston to wall rec. clear @ .001.too tight IMO....if you open up the clear...they simply wont work, IMO.

2.   Issues with funky ring end gaps, causing piston breakage @ top ring land. (Wrong gaps will cause rings to butt)

3.  That ridiculous skirt coating...prevents you to establish the  desired wall/to piston clear..manufacturer simply
     gives you a size to finish the bores to ...printed on the box :thumbdown: The coating does more harm than good.
     Shit , you may as well graphite coat the whole engine assy, try establishing clearances then :thumbdown:

4.  Hyp. pistons as you said GT, have too much "Cam", plus are not impact friendly, anything contacts the piston
     it will EXPLODE...same result if ring end gaps are not exact....Just  MHO....Not to say I dont like these pistons :sly:
« Last Edit: May 02, 2010, 02:39:16 PM by enginedoctor »
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Brad @ SCJB

  • Karma: +255/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #19 on: May 02, 2010, 04:31:20 PM »
heres some pics of what happens to hypers when in a marine application....









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Nordie

  • Karma: +13/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #20 on: May 02, 2010, 04:46:27 PM »
wow...im going to take a guess and say the top ring was in there a little tight
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enginedoctor

  • Karma: +7/-0
Re: Hyperueutectic coated pistons for marine applications!
« Reply #21 on: May 02, 2010, 07:11:01 PM »
wow...im going to take a guess and say the top ring was in there a little tight

Thats the problem nordie....Guesswork :thumbdown:
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