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Messages - TIMINATOR

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26
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: 990's vs 781
« on: June 01, 2015, 09:54:42 PM »
The typical crossover RPM between prepped ovals and squares is around 5800/6000. Below that ovals, above that squares make more power.
We built two identical 496s about 5 yrs ago for brothers. Comp solid roller cams: 246@.050 and .623 lift, performer airgap intakes, 850 holley dp, 9.6 compression, both sets pocket ported by me, 2.19/1.88 in both and unshrouded. 049s and 990s, its what they had. boats near identical 18 1/2 Kachina and Challenger, I built both pumps and did both set backs and set ups. both "A" impellers, both DPS inducers. both had Bassets and no mufflers. 049 boat: 73mph, 990 boat: 70, cut 990 impeller to "B" and they ran near identical, except it used more fuel, went BC on 990 boat and fuel was worse and gained only 1 mph. REMEMBER, these were 496s, we don't often bother with 454s.    TIMINATOR

27
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: Set screw stuck in foot peddle
« on: June 01, 2015, 09:01:32 AM »
Thread size is 1/4-20, you can Helicoil it or just tap it out to 5/16-18. If you go with the 5/16 size, then put a small point on the tip of the screw so it will go into the slot. We use stainless steel fasteners and always put a little Anti Seize on the threads before tightening. That way you can remove it when required. TIMINATOR

28
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: Gate Valve Off Pump Inlet?
« on: June 01, 2015, 08:52:22 AM »
By knowing the pressure at the various RPMs, you can figure the Gallons per minute flow at THAT RPM, and that changes with RPM/pump pressure.
Why does the engine block drain while sitting in the lake? Gravity. Water always seeks its own level.
The water jacket of the heads and almost always the entire engine block is above the level of the water outside the boat.
Water seeks its own level. The water in the engine will drain down to the level of the water outside, usually emptying most of the block, and all of the heads.
Before I moved to Phoenix, in the 1970s, we had a customer that didn't like the time that it took to refill the engine when started. So he added a check valve in the pressure line from the pump. He had almost immediate water flow upon start up, and I figured he had stumbled onto a good idea. I wondered why the boat companies didn't incorporate this feature. We got our answer next spring when the first time in the water he discovered that the block was cracked in several places on both sides in the lower water jacket area and the freeze plugs were severely corroded. It freezes back East. Lake water also contains no antifreeze/corrosion protection, so steel freeze plugs and iron blocks, and heads, whether iron or aluminum will  be corroded with water standing in it all winter.         
Water drains from the engine back into the pump, into the bowl, and out to the lake thru the impeller and suction housing.
Don't believe that? Remove the pump feed line to the engine and connect a garden hose to the pump itself, when you see water running from the pump you will be convinced.
It may take 3 or 4 minutes to drain the engine, but how long were you sitting in the lake putting out a skier, or B.S.ing about whose boat is faster before the time you actually raced? The heads empty first because they on top of the engine, but they are the hottest part of the engine and need the most cooling water, just sayin'.
When you put the boat on the trailer and take it out of the lake, did you ever notice how long it takes for the water to stop running out of the pump inlet? That's because the block and heads are emptying thru it. It takes just as long in the lake, but it does happen.
I did not expect this issue to become an encyclopedia, I thought everyone would have grasped these concepts much sooner, but since not everybody did, it just took a bit more explaining.   TIMINATOR

29
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: Gate Valve Off Pump Inlet?
« on: May 31, 2015, 08:05:36 PM »
You don't need a flowmeter, install the gauge at the inlet to the head, perpendicular to the inlet flow (to get an accurate reading use a standard "T", the inlet from the pump goes in the side of the fitting, the gauge in one end, and the block at the other end), then read and record the inlet pressure at idle, at say: 2000RPM, 3000 RPM, 4000 RPM, and every 1000 RPM to max RPM while running down the lake. Then while at home, install a garden hose to the inlet hose after you remove it from the pump. Now set the garden hose pressure to the idle pressure, and run the DUMP water onto the ground, run the hose at that pressure to fill the engine and when water is flowing freely out of the dump line, then put the bucket under the dump fitting,  and run the hose for one minute and remove the bucket, read the amount of water in the bucket, and this is how many gallons per minute the flow is at idle. Empty the bucket and repeat at every 1000 RPM and record all of this info. You will now KNOW the ACTUAL gallons per minute of cooling water that is going thru the engine. No guessing here! Then let the engine empty itself of water, some take longer than others, (the boat must lean back on the trailer at the angle that it sits in the water/lake), turn on the water at the full RPM pressure the motor can run and time the length of time until the water is FULLY FLOWING from the dump line. This is how long it takes to fill the system from sitting empty in the lake, to full throttle with full cooling. If that doesn't bother you, do the same at say idle and 3000 RPM. The first dozen times we did all of this (about 30+ years ago,) we were surprised, and that's why we don't restrict the inlet. Yes, I'm anal about everything, so I don't have to guess.  You don't have to believe me about anything, try this yourself.   TIMINATOR

30
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: Gate Valve Off Pump Inlet?
« on: May 31, 2015, 06:41:28 AM »
30 gallons per minute is a gallon every 2 seconds, thru a 3/8" hole.........    somebody take a garden hose which is 5/8" I.D, and standard municipal water pressure is 50-60 lbs, and see how long it takes to put a gallon in a bucket. Question everything, it makes you smarter.    just saying....   TIMINATOR

31
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: Gate Valve Off Pump Inlet?
« on: May 30, 2015, 03:48:07 PM »
GT I disagree.
You all figure it out since I don't like to restrict the flow anyway.
The abovementioned info was a result of over 40 years of being both a performance machine shop owner/operator specializing in boat engines AND pump builder/ machinist.   
Others experiences may vary.   
TIMINATOR

32
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: Gate Valve Off Pump Inlet?
« on: May 30, 2015, 09:05:29 AM »
Block pressure will vary depending on: where the gauge is installed in relation to the dump line
                                                         what size dump line and how many of them
                                                         what is the dump line fitting outlet size
                                                         head gasket design I.E. car or marine
                                                         water feed line and "T" size
                                                         max engine RPM/HP (higher RPM means more bowl pressure)
                                                         nozzle size (changes bowl pressure)                 
                                                         bowl and impeller type (see above)
                                                         BB Chevys depend upon the year of the block, I.E. 1,2,or 3 center/lower coolant deck holes and     
                                                              Gen 4,5,or 6, they have different front and rear deck holes
                                                                        TIMINATOR

33
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: what autolite plug
« on: May 30, 2015, 08:45:16 AM »
Not to piss on your parade, but boat turbo set-ups have water cooled turbos, and pipes to the turbos, google some other setups for info. It may run great, but your insurance company, the Coast Guard and lake cops have different ideas. Please don't cover it with a deck without the water cooled stuff installed, as hot as turbos run you are looking at melting or igniting anything near them.   TIMINATOR

34
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: Basset headers
« on: May 29, 2015, 12:46:41 PM »
The Bassett "T" is a small on/off regulator, it keeps water out of the exhaust below about 1500-1800 RPM, that's normal. In the -8 fitting on the "spider" (that's the small lines that screw in the headers themselves) there is a double male that connects it to the feed hose. That fitting, if correct, has a divider in the center, and that divider has a hole from .080" to .120" diameter to regulate the amount of flow into the "spider". It sounds as if you either don't have that proper fitting, or the hole is too large. These exist because there is a great deal of difference in the pump pressure and block pressure found in jet boats. What was fine with your near stock engine will be too large when the new engine spins the pump faster and to a higher pressure.   
Always replace the calibrated spring and ball in the beginning of every season too, they rust and corrode.  Timinator

35
All points taken and valid.
If its blue, don't use it!
Any crank grinder worth his title will fully inspect the entire crank, including the snout and threads and advise before the grind.
Most Olds cranks were in little old ladies Vista Cruisers that never or rarely had the oil changed, so they had surface wear only. Many of those same old peeps, like my grandfather (1964 Pontiac Star Chief, bought new) kept their cars for 20 + years and still never changed the oil even tho he had the engine rebuilt twice. I believe his quote was: "all oil is 20 million years old, what's a year or three in an engine? It gets freshened when more oil is added."
Take it in to a professional and let him decide.   
As far as multiple grind go, is it a race boat or lake boat? Stock crank or aftermarket? Chinese aftermarket or Callies $2600.00 crank? What can you afford? Does somebodies life depend on it working? Food for thought, only.   TIMINATOR

36
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: Cruisin the Internet
« on: May 29, 2015, 11:48:53 AM »
If you are satisfied with the way it runs and its not broken, leave it alone. Otherwise I have to know what the: boat, cam, intake, carb, exhaust, current valve sizes, porting if any, use of boat, and depth of your wallet is to give you good info. Heads could gain from 0 to 5 MPH depending on factors. Call me 623-877-8553

37
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: Cruisin the Internet
« on: May 29, 2015, 10:55:01 AM »
I run AFR or the Pro 1s in my serious stuff and for my customers when applicable. We sell the Chinese heads for lesser apps, to peeps with less cash. Usually when the customer's BBChevy needs to be completely redone is a popular choice. To bake, blast, mag, install bronze race guides, surface, do a 5 angle valve job, cut the seats for larger valves, unshroud the chambers, cut the spring seats for larger springs, dissemble & and reassemble, and buy: valves, springs, retainers, locks, and stem seals, it is much more cost effective to buy the Chinese castings, and we haven't even mentioned porting either.  I have a Super Flow flow bench and I know what everything flows.
     What many people don't understand is that better flow at a higher lift than the cam that's in the engine is not contributing to the HP output.  I.E. if the better head flows more at .750 lift and the cam is say .720 lift (then subtract the lash too, to get .695 lift) the flow at .750 lift is irrelevant. MOST lake boaters with jets usually run something like the Comp Cams 246@ .050 and .623 lift solid roller in a 496 BBC or BBF, its a pretty popular entry level deal with pocket ported stock heads or Pro-Comp oval port heads. The Pro Comps out of the box are comparable in price or cheaper than ported stock BBC heads, out flow them, and are 50 lbs. lighter. Cost effective!
In my 572", 14-71 blown, intercooled 25 Daytona, I run ported Big Brodies, my 598" 22 Daytona runs ported Dart 360s. Not all of my customers can afford that.
Wife and I drive a pair of Harleys, a GMC truck and a Cadillac, I buy American when practical, I also realize that many American companies import their entire inventory. The "house brand" of many parts purveyors is Chinese. That includes intake manifolds, rocker covers, roller rockers, oil pans, timing covers, air cleaners, and AN braided hose and fittings among others.  TIMINATOR

38
GT call me sometime and we'll talk, no hard feelings here. Just differences of opinion and those bring out better info for everyone.  I'll explain my thoughts on discussions too.     TIMINATOR

39
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: Cruisin the Internet
« on: May 29, 2015, 07:29:28 AM »
We have sold hundreds of Chinese heads in the last 15 years with NO ISSUES FROM THE CASTINGS. That's more than I can say for the other 4 brands of American heads we also sell. We don't use Chineese valves in boat at all or any HP applications, only Ferrea valves, and those in the super alloy for exhaust valves and 6000 series in the intakes. Most "seat that fell out" failures were caused by cheap valves failing first, too much water injection, or any water injection below 1800 RPM. We also have 2 sets of AFRs and a RHS head in for repair at this time. TIMINATOR

40
Cast cranks are not hardfaced, grind it to what it needs. Many bearings are supplied not only in .010, .020, and .030, but .040 and .060 also. Before cheap stroker cranks were common, we offset ground 460 Ford crank rod journals to use Pontiac rods (.250", yup that's a quarter inch undersize) to stroke them out to near 500", depending upon bore size. We used 403 Olds pistons and rings, that gave us a completely off the shelf 498" Ford. We had a ton of them in 4x4s and boats, they lived fine at over 500 HP. With custom oversize pistons they would be around 512". I suppose that we shouldn't be offset grinding 500 Cadillac crank rods down to BB Chevy size, (that's 3/8", yup .375" under) either. We have another one in here now that we are doing. Eagle rods and Ross pistons in this one. Incidentally, with the overbore this Caddy will be 548". And if we are the only people making this mistake can anyone account for the bazillion 383 Chevys out there with the mains cut from 400 to 350 size? As far as steel cranks go, other than the BBChevy 454 LS cranks from the 1970s (those had black counterweights from the Nitride hardening), I can't remember many factory steel cranks that were hardened at all.  TIMINATOR

41
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: Engine Dyno tuning?
« on: May 28, 2015, 06:45:38 PM »
A jet pump is a single RPM dyno. Where the motors HP output crosses the pumps power absorption you have found what RPM the motors gonna be able to spin. Any power above that RPM is useless unless you are going to keep cutting the impeller to get that exact RPM. BUT, the more you cut back an impeller, the less efficient it becomes.  There comes a point of diminishing returns where the pump efficiency will drop off faster than the HP increase due to the higher engine RPM. Above that point the boat will run slower at any higher RPM. Screw the dyno and spend the cash on better heads or a roller cam. The RPM, power, and speed will go up.  Most of the boats we see have the pump built to absorb some inflated HP that the engine builder promised and didn't deliver. Magazine HP! Not real world HP.  Let the s**tstorm begin.    TIMINATOR

42
Factory Q-jets on Olds 455s were 810 CFM stock! On cars! With smaller cams! Why go smaller on the carb? An 850 DP works great on a Crosswind dual plane intake for the Olds. I have a new one, and I have an Olds O4B intake too.  Start with the stock jets and change the power valve to a 45 (which actually starts the enrichment at 4.5" mercury. The Comp 280 is one of the better (but not the best) jetboat cam with log exhausts. TIMINATOR

43
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: Gate Valve Off Pump Inlet?
« on: May 28, 2015, 06:04:16 PM »
Stainless pipe and fittings are easy to find, use them. You need the gate or ball valve for safety reasons, like when a freeze plug blows or rusts out, you don't want to sink the boat over that. Do not use the valve as a restriction to limit the water flow to the engine to get the temperature up, if you want the temp up, buy a jet-boat thermostat kit. When you are sitting in the water B.S.ing about whose boat is faster, and start up and floor it, it can take 40 seconds to near a minute to fully fill the block, and there you are at full throttle..... when the cold water hits the hot head, you get cracks, they start out small, but they grow. Try this yourself, with a dry block, connect the garden hose to the pump side of the valve at the opening you normally run it. Turn on the hose and see how long it takes for water to come out of the dump line. Put a pressure gauge in the motor and see how much pressure the pump is supplying while underway. The municipal water system is 50-60 pounds. Do the math.  Just sayin'  TIMINATOR

44
Disconnect the driveshaft and run the engine, if no vibration fix the mount issue, if its still there the engine balance is wrong. At our shop we etch the balance number on the crank, flywheel and balancer, whether internally or externally balanced. Our balance card also indicates internal or external balance. Any good shop should do this and have the info immediately available by phone.  TIMINATOR

45
Many Olds cranks (and others in the old days, like some Cadillacs) have the blind holes in the crank. The thought was when the holes passed the oil delivery slot in the upper bearing, the blind hole would fill with oil, and when it was in the lower part of the bearing the oil would centrifugally be thrown out to help with lubrication. The rod bearing size and main bearing sizes can be and often are different when remachined. No sense in removing good bearing surface of the mains if not needed to clean up the main journal with less grinding. You would grind all the mains or rods the same, but not more than needed and not necessarily the same amount for the rods and for the mains.  TIMINATOR

46
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: Water pressure
« on: May 14, 2013, 09:32:14 AM »
I have owned my own Race and performance business for over 40 years, written over 50-60 magazine articles for several Performance car and boat magazines, had a tech column, still write for Industry only magazines, not monthly newsstand stuff. I was guilty of oversimplification in some statements. There is no reason for me to banter semantics with anyone. Refer to my last post: "It must be worth my time."

47
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: Water pressure
« on: May 14, 2013, 07:09:55 AM »
Refer to the 5 rules of discussion. Anyone remember those? #5 It must be worth my time.

48
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: Water pressure
« on: May 13, 2013, 07:25:53 PM »
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49
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: Water pressure
« on: May 13, 2013, 08:09:08 AM »
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50
Engine Mechanical / Electrical / Re: Cam selection
« on: May 13, 2013, 07:41:44 AM »
Max lift occurs when the piston is more than halfway down the cylinder. It does NOT cause piston/valve interference. Duration causes P/V interference during the overlap period when both valves are open. In a BBC the exhaust will clear near anything since its so far away from the piston crown. A tight lobe SEPARATION is just what a jet needs, it gives a narrow, peakier power band, but causes more interference problems. A jet only needs max power at max RPM of the pump capability (what the engine can actually turn it to). A BBC with the typical flat top piston with no intake notch, un milled heads, un milled deck will sometimes (50/50 chance, but will sometimes self clearance with a small crescent where the intake valve touches) clear the piston with a Comp Cams 292 hydraulic (great for Bassett exhaust, but too big for logs). A safer alternative and one that will always work is the Comp 288 or XE284 for Bassetts, and the XE 268 for log exhausts. Comp cams have typically faster ramp rates than other cams, this makes more power, but will cause a light valvetrain noise(ticking that you can't seem to get rid of, so don't try.) The best jet boat Comp solid roller is the 288AR, or for 496 builds if you want a bit more, the Comp XR286R. Any cam that says"easy on parts", or comes from a small or older "traditional" cam company usually means its ramp rate is slow, and may not make much more, or any more power than a fast ramp rate hydraulic cam(I.E. Comp Magnum or especially the Extreme energy series cams.) I have a cam analyzer and have analyzed thousands of cams in the last 25+ years. We charge  $18.50 for this service, and can save you much cash and time. Ramp rate is extremely important to power production, and all cam companies don't have the latest computer design or manufacturing equipment. You can't tell ramp rate, or quality by looking at a cam. It is a safe bet that buying the same cam from the same company that your dad/uncle/neighbor used "back in the day" will be a disappointment, BUT if you never compare it to something modern, you'll probably be satisfied. At least until you race somebody with a newer setup.....  Class dismissed.  TIMINATOR

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